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> Us older people with wealth have strongly advocated for decades that they not take on the debt This is a lie, and I feel that you know it is. I graduated hig
by lenerdenator 3y ago
> Us older people with wealth have strongly advocated for decades that they not take on the debt
This is a lie, and I feel that you know it is. I graduated high school in 2009. There was tremendous pressure on students to be ready for a college degree. You were told it was absolutely necessary to compete in the new globalized economy. AP classes were offered so that you could transfer credits on entry-level coursework. SAT and ACT prep were offered by the school district. There were college spirit days and college fairs. There were signing days for athletic scholarships.
You'll find most Millennials will recall much of the same if they came from a middle-class-or-above area. Of course, being middle class doesn't mean you can pay for college without debt. That's why they took it on.
The idea of entering the trades was an afterthought to the point where there was a vocational center 20 miles away that serviced an entire suburban county's worth of high school students.
Since it was right after the financial crisis, if you weren't going to college or going into a vocational program, you were going into the military. I'd say more people out of my high school class went into the military than vocational programs. They were trained, given a job for six months, and discharged because there was a massive pool of people, nationally, who wanted to join the military since they had no place else to go.
> Of those who thought they knew better, why would we want to pay for their stupidity?
See above.
> But if we agree that we should pay for stupidity because that's the nice thing to do, why stop at college? What about the dumb kid who bought a Ferrari he can't afford? Are we going to pay for that too? Logically we should. There is no difference.
This is comically obtuse. No one ever centered a state's high school curriculum around the idea of convincing a kid to buy a Ferrari. No one ever told the kid he'd be a nobody with no future earnings potential if he didn't buy a Ferrari. That's exactly what Millennials were told between 1995 and 2010. The Ferrari doesn't get exempted from bankruptcy because "you kept the skills you learned" from owning it. I'd much rather be in debt from owning a Ferrari than with a student loan.
> ~60% of the population (in the USA) have not attended college. Why not let them reap the rewards of their choices?
There are no rewards to having a large chunk of your population so indebted that they don't engage in the life milestones that allow the economy to grow for the next 20 years. That guy who was so smart as to avoid that liberal arts degree by going to trade school to learn how to be an electrician? He needs new housing and commercial buildings to work on if he'd like to earn a living and create more economic value than he consumes. If no one's building houses to start a family, and no one's building new businesses because the population isn't there to support it, he's just as screwed as everyone else.
You're angry at the wrong people.
- randomdata 3y ago> There was tremendous pressure on students to be ready for a college degree. Yes, I lived it. I felt the pressure too. I even remember having to endure a phone call with an adult family friend who was practically crying because I wasn't going to college. That was painfully uncomfortable, and illustrative of just how stupid it was getting. But I can also do math... Facts and logic supersede any attempts to pull at heartstrings. Perhaps the bigger question is: Why are we accepting students into college if they can't do basic math? College should not be a replacement for a failed elementary school experience, surely? > if you weren't going to college or going into a vocational program, you were going into the military. I'm not sure this stands up. The majority of people in that cohort did not attend college during that time. Nor did the equivalent cohort before and not today either. You seem to be living in a bubble. Yeah, maybe a small group of people were banished from their parents wings and would have otherwise been left the streets if they weren't able to secure student loans to cover the cost of rent, but this can't be any meaningful chunk of the population. Especially when you consider that college students, statistically, come from the wealthiest families. Furthermore, the recovery from that economic decline is considered to have taken only two years from crash to full recovery. One wouldn't have needed to rack up that much debt at a budget school before they were able to get back on their feet. > There are no rewards to having a large chunk of your population so indebted that they don't engage in the life milestones that allow the economy to grow for the next 20 years. Right, so free up mortgage debt, then. It's not great either, but I think we can at least agree that we want people to keep on having homes. We don't want people to continue to waste their time in college. If you perversely send the message that it's okay to waste that time because someone else will pay for it, people will keep on doing it. Bad actions need consequences. > You're angry at the wrong people. No, the problem is clearly those who didn't do the math. Even after I warned them[1]! This outcome was painfully obvious even in the 90s. But, okay, explain to me why my sacrifice in skipping out on the fun of college in order to build wealth should come with even more sacrifice so that those who chose fun get to keep on having fun? When is my time to have fun? Why do you want to punish me for doing the 'right' thing? [1] I'm not famous, so fair enough that doesn't go so far, but it was also talked about quite a bit in the mainstream media by the time the turn of the century came around. I was hardly the only person able to do the math. Some people just didn't want to listen, or thought they knew better.