21 ms·

A lot of people are saying there are advantages to visual quality for CRT monitors. I don't disagree, but most what I remember from my gaming obsessed childhood

A lot of people are saying there are advantages to visual quality for CRT monitors. I don't disagree, but most what I remember from my gaming obsessed childhood are strong headaches from prolonged sessions, which disappeared after move to CRT. I don't play games anywhere close to what I used to do, but I can't imagine working for 8-10 hours on CRT monitor and not losing health.

nottorp 3y ago
Interesting, because I still think lcd monitors BLIND ME a lot more than the old CRTs. But then when you're programming with a black background with the brightness turned way way down on a crt, there is very little light shining into your face. Maybe oled will fix that, but it still has some growing up to do.
- Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
  > I still think lcd monitors BLIND ME User error, IMO. I'm of the opinion that if your monitor showing a pure white screen is painful, then either your brightness is too high or you don't have adequate ambient light.
  - nottorp 3y ago
    They’re always turned down as much as I can without losing contrast and I do have light in my office. It’s still not the same as a black screen that’s not emitting light. You said it yourself actually: lcd monitors do require ambient light to not be painful. CRTs could do without.
    - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
      I've always felt the opposite. When I was a kid, if I was playing NES/SNES games on my TV with no lights on, after an hour or so, my eyes were burning.
      - nottorp 3y ago
        Hmm when I was a kid kid I was only playing on my TV in the living room during the day with natural ambient light :) Anyway I've never been burned burned by tv or monitor lighting, but I've started to see less well in the dark just a few years after switching to lcds. Being under 30, maybe closer to 25 than 30. To the point that my wife asks me why I keep turning lights on at dusk in rooms where she sees perfectly with what's left of the sunlight.
  - amlib 3y ago
    Even tough LCDs sample and hold (so, no refresh flicker like a CRT) many employ a PWM to modulate the backlight brightness which will cause it to flicker in excess of your refresh rate, with the pattern varying according to the set brightness. Some PWM flicker might reach a frequency that is low enough to bother you, I've read about people who bought a brand new LCD TV and had to return it due to headaches, supposedly attributed to the rate of flicking by the PWM. Some monitors are sometimes even reviewed as not employing a PWM thus being easier on the eyes.
    - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
      I don't think I've ever noticed flicker on an LCD screen, even when I first started using LCD some time in the mid '00s. And I definitely notice the flicker in a CRT, especially when I'm not looking straight at it (oddly). Heck, I see the flicker of LED Christmas lights.
      - amlib 3y ago
        You will never visually see flicker on an LCD unless it's malfunctioning or you have activated black frame insertion. But the flicker is still there on PWM equiped ones, only visible with special equipment or slow motion cameras. The problem them is that your brain might be subconsciously sensitive to some specific flicker patterns, resulting in the aforementioned headaches.
    - kanbankaren 3y ago
      From what I have read, the PWM frequency for LCD backlights is in the order of several kHz which is unlikely to be a nuisance.
      - amlib 3y ago
        Yes, but some implementations or edge cases (like putting some TVs/monitors in it's max brightness/dynamic mode) can have the PWM frequency drop to as low as 120hz with god knows what duty cycle.
xeeeeeeeeeeenu 3y ago
This was likely due to flickering because of low refresh rate. On CRTs, 60 Hz feels terrible, 85 Hz is much more comfortable.
- pezezin 3y ago
  Back in the day, 85 Hz was the absolute minimum that I could tolerate. Less than that and I would get serious eye strain very quickly.
pezezin 3y ago
I love visiting retro arcades every time I get the chance, but after an hour of playing I get a headache. And let's be honest, many CRT don't look that great, they tend to suffer from bad geometry and color aberrations.

nottorp 3y ago

Interesting, because I still think lcd monitors BLIND ME a lot more than the old CRTs. But then when you're programming with a black background with the brightness turned way way down on a crt, there is very little light shining into your face. Maybe oled will fix that, but it still has some growing up to do.

Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
> I still think lcd monitors BLIND ME User error, IMO. I'm of the opinion that if your monitor showing a pure white screen is painful, then either your brightness is too high or you don't have adequate ambient light.
- nottorp 3y ago
  They’re always turned down as much as I can without losing contrast and I do have light in my office. It’s still not the same as a black screen that’s not emitting light. You said it yourself actually: lcd monitors do require ambient light to not be painful. CRTs could do without.
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    I've always felt the opposite. When I was a kid, if I was playing NES/SNES games on my TV with no lights on, after an hour or so, my eyes were burning.
    - nottorp 3y ago
      Hmm when I was a kid kid I was only playing on my TV in the living room during the day with natural ambient light :) Anyway I've never been burned burned by tv or monitor lighting, but I've started to see less well in the dark just a few years after switching to lcds. Being under 30, maybe closer to 25 than 30. To the point that my wife asks me why I keep turning lights on at dusk in rooms where she sees perfectly with what's left of the sunlight.
- amlib 3y ago
  Even tough LCDs sample and hold (so, no refresh flicker like a CRT) many employ a PWM to modulate the backlight brightness which will cause it to flicker in excess of your refresh rate, with the pattern varying according to the set brightness. Some PWM flicker might reach a frequency that is low enough to bother you, I've read about people who bought a brand new LCD TV and had to return it due to headaches, supposedly attributed to the rate of flicking by the PWM. Some monitors are sometimes even reviewed as not employing a PWM thus being easier on the eyes.
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    I don't think I've ever noticed flicker on an LCD screen, even when I first started using LCD some time in the mid '00s. And I definitely notice the flicker in a CRT, especially when I'm not looking straight at it (oddly). Heck, I see the flicker of LED Christmas lights.
    - amlib 3y ago
      You will never visually see flicker on an LCD unless it's malfunctioning or you have activated black frame insertion. But the flicker is still there on PWM equiped ones, only visible with special equipment or slow motion cameras. The problem them is that your brain might be subconsciously sensitive to some specific flicker patterns, resulting in the aforementioned headaches.
  - kanbankaren 3y ago
    From what I have read, the PWM frequency for LCD backlights is in the order of several kHz which is unlikely to be a nuisance.
    - amlib 3y ago
      Yes, but some implementations or edge cases (like putting some TVs/monitors in it's max brightness/dynamic mode) can have the PWM frequency drop to as low as 120hz with god knows what duty cycle.

xeeeeeeeeeeenu 3y ago

This was likely due to flickering because of low refresh rate. On CRTs, 60 Hz feels terrible, 85 Hz is much more comfortable.

pezezin 3y ago
Back in the day, 85 Hz was the absolute minimum that I could tolerate. Less than that and I would get serious eye strain very quickly.

pezezin 3y ago

I love visiting retro arcades every time I get the chance, but after an hour of playing I get a headache. And let's be honest, many CRT don't look that great, they tend to suffer from bad geometry and color aberrations.