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Apparently all that's required to make recording a phone call legal is to play a 3 second recorded message saying "This call may be recorded for quality and tra
by modeless 3y ago
Apparently all that's required to make recording a phone call legal is to play a 3 second recorded message saying "This call may be recorded for quality and training purposes" because that's what every corporation does. They don't ask, or verify consent. Why can't I do that on my phone? I will happily have my phone say "This call may be recorded" before every call I pick up, so that every call can be recorded.
- colechristensen 3y agoPresumably you could.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> all that's required to make recording a phone call legal is to play a 3 second recorded message In some jurisdictions, all that is required is an audible beep (or even no notice at all). In others, full consent [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_call_recording_laws#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_call_recording_laws#...
- jojobas 3y agoThe idea is that if you don't consent you hang up after hearing the message. Funnily, the phrasing "may be recorded" is not interpreted by the corporations as "the customer may be recording as well" and in many cases their default policy is to not talk to you if you've declared you're recording. Single-party consent jurisdictions make it even more muddy.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> Single-party consent jurisdictions make it even more muddy Don't they simplify it? You're on the call. If you consent to recording, you've given your single-party consent. You don't need to tell the company you're calling you're recording.
- jojobas 3y agoYou don't but if you do they'll hang up. The whole "the call may be recorded, but only by us" is rather idiotic still.
- modeless 3y agoJust say it while you are on hold. They don't make any effort to ensure you hear their notification, so why should you make any effort to ensure that they hear yours?
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> Just say it while you are on hold. They don't make any effort to ensure you hear their notification, so why should you make any effort to ensure that they hear yours? This is possibly worse than staying silent, given you're betraying bad intent.
- jojobas 3y agoYep. Them saying it may be recorded for quality purposes should be enough, your complaint using the recording is to improve the quality of service you receive.
- gruez 3y ago>Funnily, the phrasing "may be recorded" is not interpreted by the corporations as "the customer may be recording as well" IANAL but AFAIK the "this call is recorded ..." warning that they automatically play gives license for both sides to record, even in a 2 party consent state.
- jojobas 3y agoStill they'll hang up if you announce your recording explicitly, go ahead and try that on your cell provider, ISP or bank.
- noman-land 3y agoIf they announce it then you don't have to.
- xethos 3y agoThe point is more the attitude of "Fine for me but not for thee", with the corporation in question almost undoubtedly recording the call, but balking when a consumer dares do the same
- smeej 3y agoMy car insurance company actually refused to talk to me when I called them after my accident, knowing their phone line would tell me the call may be recorded, and therefore I would record it. They would only talk to me if they called me, so I started answering with, "This call may be recorded. By continuing, you acknowledge your consent." Most of the time, they just hung up. They were trying to screw me, and the state insurance commissioner finally had to step in and put them in their place. The person who caused the accident had the same carrier I did, and since they knew they were on the hook for the charges either way, they made no effort at all to adjudicate fault. They wanted to split it 50-50, and I wasn't having it.
- k8svet 3y agoFun times, try telling those same corporations that you're recording the call. I've yet to have any proceed other than (politely, but promptly) disconnecting the call.
- joering2 3y agoHonestly I always take "This call may be recorded" as two way consent :) one time someone was referring to person with hard to pronounce name and I said "that's fine I will play it back". Person responded: "wait, are you recording? I didn't give you my consent". To which I said yes you did, when I called your line answered with announcement that this call can be recorded. He wasn't too happy :)
- PeterisP 3y agoIt's a bit tricky, since "this call may be recorded" often is played only to you before connecting to the other person, so technically this announcement was not made to them.
- smeej 3y agoTheir line helpfully tells you in advance "this call may be recorded." Great! Looks like permission to me! Record I shall! If they object to the call's being recorded, they ought to take that up with whomever controls their phone lines.
- riskable 3y agoIf you're calling a corporation (or they called you) then it's the corporation that's the legal entity being recorded... Not the person on the other end of the phone.
- PeterisP 3y agoPeople have separate rights even if they are employees, and wiretapping laws apply to recording people - like, the company recording their own calls can easily be a violation of wiretapping laws if they don't properly inform their employees.
- morkalork 3y agoI love how they dress it up as "may be recorded", as if whenever you hear that message there's a small chance the recording isn't sitting in some S3 bucket.
- wolverine876 3y agoIf they do something wrong, it might not be recorded.
- clbrmbr 3y agoWithout the “may” the individual may feel they can request THE recording and if the company does not provide it then that make a big stink of it.
- Teever 3y agoAlways felt that was dubiously legal in places that require consent to record.
- noman-land 3y agoYou can and should.
- kevin_thibedeau 3y agoIf you live in a state that only requires single-party consent you can record at will your own conversations without disclosure.
- mmmBacon 3y agoWhen you do get a live person, you can say that you do not consent to be recorded. When I’ve done this the person on the other end claims to stop recording.
- dandrew5 3y agoThis reminds me of an old idea I called Reverse MFA where the person you're talking to over the phone must provide a valid 6 digit number before you give out personal details like birthday, SSN, etc.
- m463 3y agosort of related, I wish phones generally allowed extensions. In other words, phone number plus a 6-digit extension, otherwise voicemail. Sort of like your code, but allowing a person to talk to you in the first place.
- user_7832 3y agoNot exactly the same, but wouldn't it be possible using a VOIP service like Google Fi to have/generate a large number of phone numbers? Give each contact their unique number, so if you ever get spam called you can detect where your number leaked from. (If it isn't directly possible, I'm fairly sure using some sort of iot telephony servive would help getting hundreds of legitimate numbers. Now only to build a cell interceptor to funnel them all to one phone!)
- simoncion 3y agoI don't think Google Fi is a VoIP service? At least, not any more one than any other cellular provider in these days where "WiFi Calling" is widespread. Last I knew, they used T-Mobile for their cellular connection.
- ruined 3y agothis is technically possible at the phone level, but all the business infrastructure enforces ten digit validation.
- m463 3y agoit's a wish, probably a fantasy. but it could be like letting smart people organize their life using email addresses in a similar way: foo+extra@gmail.com
- callalex 3y agoAlways be in the habit of saying “me too” to the robot that plays that message. Then it’s not even deceptive, you clearly stated to the other “party” that you are recording. Not your problem if the other end wasn’t listening because they made you talk to a poorly built robot.
- Terr_ 3y agoIn which jurisdictions--if any--does that actually matter? AFAIK there is no state where anti-recording rules are asymmetric between participants. Either both have an expectation of non-recording, or neither do.
- madcoderme 3y agoI am not a lawyer or something, but maybe, saying "By continuing, you agree to have the call recorded for quality and training purposes" makes more sense? It's technically verifying the consent, I guess.
- wil421 3y agoWhy would I have to say anything in a one party consent state?
- smeej 3y agoGoogle Voice can record calls if you press 4. A voice comes on and says so. Only a couple times have I used it on purpose, but it has triggered on me accidentally a handful of times over the years, usually in weird situations like in my car (older cars, with Bluetooth-only car phone systems). Makes everybody nervous, myself included.
- kristofferR 3y agoMay is a synonym for can. "May/can I use the bathroom?" So they are giving you explicit permission to record the call if they say the call may be recorded.
- kwhitefoot 3y agoNo it isn't. May is about permission or likelihood. Can is about capability. A telephone call can be recorded even if it may not be recorded. That is the recording apparatus exists and is connected needing only the signal to start recording but permission is not forthcoming. It is only in colloquial speech that the two are equivalent.