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I applied to over 70 jobs at Hampshire college, UMass Amherst, Mt Holyoke College and Amherst College. All open positions, not 1 interview. I'm a white man. I
by fidla 3y ago
I applied to over 70 jobs at Hampshire college, UMass Amherst, Mt Holyoke College and Amherst College. All open positions, not 1 interview. I'm a white man. I finally took my race, and gender off the application and got 3 interviews right away
- r9295 3y agoWhy did you include your race and gender in your application?
- pksebben 3y agoThis is a fair point. Including them is a little weird in the first place and totally a red flag.
- zero-sharp 3y agoI can find plenty of Indeed postings that won't let you submit the application without specifying ...
- speedgoose 3y agoCould it be a USA thing?
- t-writescode 3y agoI'm not in HR; but I imagine they're very averse to anything that might reflect bias in employment and putting your gender, current ability to get pregnant, religion, etc, on a resume would absolutely count in that way, I imagine.
- hackable_sand 3y agoDefinitely not US. We have voluntary self identification.
- zero-sharp 3y agoYea that's how it's supposed to be, right? However, I am sure that I've seen applications which don't categorize that input as optional.
- hlieberman 3y agoHonest question: why was race and gender even /on/ your application in the first place? Do you mean the EEO questions that they ask -- because those are absolutely not supposed to be part of the application. Or do you mean you have it on your resume? Because... why?
- spuzz 3y agoIDK about this guy, maybe just trolling, but when I was hiring I realized you can really tell from indirect information. Name and college name will give you a real strong guess. It was weird because I was just trying to avoid h1-b applicants since I was told we weren't doing that, but I quickly realized that I was optimizing against indian people and also that taking bias out of the hiring process is a lie that HR tells itself for legal liability reasons.
- uriah 3y agoYeah, you can’t really filter based on resume without risking legal liability. There are plenty of people who look like they would need a visa sponsorship but don’t necessarily (e.g. spouses of H1B or green card holders)
- UncleOxidant 3y ago...or children of Indian immigrants.
- nextos 3y agoAFAIK, he is not trolling. Right now, in Academia, there is a very strong movement towards hiring diversity candidates. For example, some faculty openings are advertised as women or minorities only. In EU, some have sued and successfully overturned this kind of bias, as it is in principle not legal to discriminate by sex or race.
- busterarm 3y agoFor the vast majority of people you can tell by given name and surname. You get around this by picking a gender-ambiguous nickname and using that as your given name. Ariel, Logan, Dakota, Drew, Jordan, etc. Surnames are harder, but you're aiming for ambiguity. Williams, Johnson, Smith, Jones and Brown -- e.g., the five most common African American surnames. Other options like Kim and Lee will also get you far here.
- ldjkfkdsjnv 3y agoSuch is life. Not only do they not want to hire you from a dei perspective, many of the foreign engineers from India/China, also do not want to hire you. They want to hire their overseas brethren.
- UncleOxidant 3y agoYou were downvoted, and while I think DEI has some good aspects, your 2nd point is spot on because I've seen it in person at a largish, household name tech company. You see Indian managers who only have Indian engineers working for them and you see Chinese managers who only have Chinese engineers working for them. Go through the cafeteria at lunchtime and you see it pretty much ethnically sorted - the Indians aren't sitting with the Chinese, and vice versa. Now it wasn't 100%, I worked for a guy who was ethnically Chinese from Malaysia and he had Indians and whities like me working for him. But if I saw in internal job listing that looked interesting and the manager was Indian, for example, I'd look at the org chart to see the names of the people working for them to see if it was an all-Indian group. If it was then there wasn't much point in applying.
- tomwphillips 3y agoDid you re-apply to the same places with and without those factors? Because if you didn’t, it’s hard to be sure what you’re implying is true. Alternative explanation: you applied for competitive roles and didn’t hear back because there were better candidates, then you applied for less competitive roles and got interviews.
- fidla 3y agoOh yes I should have made that clear. I resubmitted my application to all of the original jobs