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> ... was a mobile network system operating in the 1880–1930 WHAT?? > ... MHz frequency band Oh. Ok, I jumped in my chair for a moment, but when my brain cal

by lopis 3y ago

> ... was a mobile network system operating in the 1880–1930 WHAT?? > ... MHz frequency band Oh. Ok, I jumped in my chair for a moment, but when my brain calmed down I realized network systems in the 19th century didn't really make sense.

lb1lf 3y ago
> but when my brain calmed down I realized network systems in the 19th century didn't really make sense. -Now, in the 18th century, on the other hand, the Chappe telegraph network was king. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappe_telegraph https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappe_telegraph
- NeoTar 3y ago
  I was about to comment similarly that this is totally a wireless telegram system! For anyone who doesn't want to click the link, it's a visual telegram system similar to semaphore codes, or the 'clacks' in Terry Pratchett's Discworld novels.
  - karambahh 3y ago
    And, as every communications systems, it was abused (as mentioned briefly in the WP page) by stock brockers between Paris and Bordeaux via a side channel attack. They used it to covertly transmit swing in trading prices between the Paris stock exchange and Bordeaux. If memory serves, they used unused symbols or abused error correction, I don't remember which, but from a technical standpoint it was pretty advanced and covert. I seem to remember they only got caught because somebody snitched them when they suddenly got veeeery good a predicting prices in Bordeaux, some 400km away from Paris. It appears transmission speed for a symbol was on the order of magnitude of 7 meters per second, and full messages travelled 400km in 9 minutes instead of 4 days by horse. So speed was a ginormous improvement despite low bandwidth and very high capex & opex and limited operating hours. It operated from 1793 to 1854 in continental France.
- peterleiser 3y ago
  The Chappe telegraph supported 98 possible signals with 6 of those being reserved for service purposes (like signalling end of message), so 92 possible message signals. If you could get that to 96 then you could transmit ASCII characters using one signal from Decimal 32 to Decimal 126, and use one signal to enter the original "two signals per symbol" mode for the rest of ASCII and other symbols. Then automate it with machine vision and we'll have an 1800's style steampunk Internet.
  - int_19h 3y ago
    ASCII is overkill anyway, nothing's wrong with 6-bit. ECMA-1 already had Escape, Shift-In, and Shift-Out as standard control characters.
- ljf 3y ago
  Man that is fascinating - too good not to share as a post itself https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40021455 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40021455
twic 3y ago
Indeed! That was almost a decade before the founding of Nintendo, absurd.
qingcharles 3y ago
Here's a video of those mobile phones in use: (warning: conspiracy content) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vwy6gSs-ljA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vwy6gSs-ljA

by lopis 3y ago

lb1lf 3y ago

> but when my brain calmed down I realized network systems in the 19th century didn't really make sense. -Now, in the 18th century, on the other hand, the Chappe telegraph network was king. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappe_telegraph https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappe_telegraph

NeoTar 3y ago
I was about to comment similarly that this is totally a wireless telegram system! For anyone who doesn't want to click the link, it's a visual telegram system similar to semaphore codes, or the 'clacks' in Terry Pratchett's Discworld novels.
- karambahh 3y ago
  And, as every communications systems, it was abused (as mentioned briefly in the WP page) by stock brockers between Paris and Bordeaux via a side channel attack. They used it to covertly transmit swing in trading prices between the Paris stock exchange and Bordeaux. If memory serves, they used unused symbols or abused error correction, I don't remember which, but from a technical standpoint it was pretty advanced and covert. I seem to remember they only got caught because somebody snitched them when they suddenly got veeeery good a predicting prices in Bordeaux, some 400km away from Paris. It appears transmission speed for a symbol was on the order of magnitude of 7 meters per second, and full messages travelled 400km in 9 minutes instead of 4 days by horse. So speed was a ginormous improvement despite low bandwidth and very high capex & opex and limited operating hours. It operated from 1793 to 1854 in continental France.
peterleiser 3y ago
The Chappe telegraph supported 98 possible signals with 6 of those being reserved for service purposes (like signalling end of message), so 92 possible message signals. If you could get that to 96 then you could transmit ASCII characters using one signal from Decimal 32 to Decimal 126, and use one signal to enter the original "two signals per symbol" mode for the rest of ASCII and other symbols. Then automate it with machine vision and we'll have an 1800's style steampunk Internet.
- int_19h 3y ago
  ASCII is overkill anyway, nothing's wrong with 6-bit. ECMA-1 already had Escape, Shift-In, and Shift-Out as standard control characters.
ljf 3y ago
Man that is fascinating - too good not to share as a post itself https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40021455 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40021455

twic 3y ago

Indeed! That was almost a decade before the founding of Nintendo, absurd.

qingcharles 3y ago

Here's a video of those mobile phones in use: (warning: conspiracy content) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vwy6gSs-ljA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vwy6gSs-ljA