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Phone layout plus * and # is extremely common on combination locks, even ones with electronic displays for keypads like this https://www.levellock.com/home-and-

Phone layout plus * and # is extremely common on combination locks, even ones with electronic displays for keypads like this https://www.levellock.com/home-and-office-electronic-lock-with-password-and-mf1-card-tdt-1550 https://www.levellock.com/home-and-office-electronic-lock-wi... so maybe it's just more widely recognized by users for non-computer, non-calculator devices. When I opened a bank account, I had to choose a PIN on the keypad in the office (probably a computer numpad with the same layout as a keyboard) and the clerk warned me that the numbers are upside down compared to an actual POS machine or ATM (which are phone layout).

Tijdreiziger 3y ago
Slightly off-topic, but ‘choosing a PIN’ is an interesting rabbit hole. Some banks send you a random PIN in a sealed letter. Other banks have you key in your choice of PIN in various manners (at a branch, online or by phone). Some banks support changing PIN at an ATM. Others don’t.
- EnigmaFlare 3y ago
  I guess it's up to their evaluation of the risk since they're the ones who'll pay for fraud if someone finds your lost card and guesses the PIN. Though if you're not going into a branch, there's no opportunity for you to choose a PIN so they have to do it for you.
  - Moru 3y ago
    Sadly not here, they put all the responsibility on you as a customer. You loose your card and don't immediately notice it, you are responsible for all lost funds until you block the card.
- Moru 3y ago
  Here in Sweden the banks have been hard at work removing all physical contact for 20 years or so. Started with lowering opening times, closing down the smallest, closing down the next smallest, only accepting booked appointments and so on. Now they are opening tiny holes in the walls of shopping malls where you can get the simplest things taken care of like a new ID card or maybe even setting up a new account if you are not customer already. If you don't have a Bank-ID on your phone you can hardly do anything any more.
dhosek 3y ago
The 3270 terminal family had a numberpad-like matrix on the right side of the keyboard which was PF1–PF12 with the PF1–3 on the top row. It was a bit confusing for people who used ASCII terminals with a numeric keypad muxed in to access IBM mainframes as occasionally software would assume the 3270 arrangement of keys but the mapping for ASCII terminals used the keypad with the keypad’s 1–0 corresponding to PF1–PF10 and . and + (if I remember right) corresponding to PF11 and PF12 and there would be seemingly irrational arrangements of commands with up and down reversed.

Tijdreiziger 3y ago

Slightly off-topic, but ‘choosing a PIN’ is an interesting rabbit hole. Some banks send you a random PIN in a sealed letter. Other banks have you key in your choice of PIN in various manners (at a branch, online or by phone). Some banks support changing PIN at an ATM. Others don’t.

EnigmaFlare 3y ago
I guess it's up to their evaluation of the risk since they're the ones who'll pay for fraud if someone finds your lost card and guesses the PIN. Though if you're not going into a branch, there's no opportunity for you to choose a PIN so they have to do it for you.
- Moru 3y ago
  Sadly not here, they put all the responsibility on you as a customer. You loose your card and don't immediately notice it, you are responsible for all lost funds until you block the card.
Moru 3y ago
Here in Sweden the banks have been hard at work removing all physical contact for 20 years or so. Started with lowering opening times, closing down the smallest, closing down the next smallest, only accepting booked appointments and so on. Now they are opening tiny holes in the walls of shopping malls where you can get the simplest things taken care of like a new ID card or maybe even setting up a new account if you are not customer already. If you don't have a Bank-ID on your phone you can hardly do anything any more.

dhosek 3y ago

The 3270 terminal family had a numberpad-like matrix on the right side of the keyboard which was PF1–PF12 with the PF1–3 on the top row. It was a bit confusing for people who used ASCII terminals with a numeric keypad muxed in to access IBM mainframes as occasionally software would assume the 3270 arrangement of keys but the mapping for ASCII terminals used the keypad with the keypad’s 1–0 corresponding to PF1–PF10 and . and + (if I remember right) corresponding to PF11 and PF12 and there would be seemingly irrational arrangements of commands with up and down reversed.