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> The videos the Tesla influencer community point to are earlier videos that did not have sufficient clarity yet to disprove their lies so they thought they wou

• Veserv 3y ago
  Except that it was engaged as stated in the Safety Test Report [1] and as seen in the raw footage [2]. Rather than acknowledging that a incomplete investigation with conflicting information demands waiting for confirmatory evidence such as the raw footage which would have demonstrated their assumptions on the validity of the test were false, they chose to immediately begin declaring it a smear campaign based on false tests. They are not liars because they point out FSD was not engaged in portions of the ad. They are liars because they then straight up ignored evidence to the contrary and then assert, in confidence, that the tests were certainly fabricated and that FSD would never operate as demonstrated even though the video evidence that was forthcoming proved their assertions were completely and utterly wrong. As to being unrepentant liars. Is a legitimate test demonstrating a critical safety defect in a consumer product a smear campaign? No. Have they retracted their false accusation that correctly exposing a critical safety defect is a smear campaign since they jumped the gun on their accusations before they did even a token investigation? No. Then it is a lie and they are unrepentant. As to being willing to fabricate whatever is convenient. As soon as it became clear that FSD was enabled during those tests, the party line became that the only reason it happened was because the accelerator was pressed. This is false as can be seen in the current video. Then it became the only reason it happened was because the cones prevented a swerve. This is false as can be seen in the current video. Then it became the only reason it happened was because they steered into the child. This is false as can be seen in the current video. Every single one of these accusations was made because they thought the video could not disprove it and every single one has been proven to be false once the video setup was improved so it could disprove them. The fact that people, to this day, still deliberately point back to the earliest videos because they can not find any way to lie about the current videos without getting caught is bad faith argumentation. To then argue the Dawn Project is untrustworthy because of false accusations made by liars is true grade A bad faith argumentation that needs to be nipped in the bud. [1] https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/The_Dawn_Project___Tesla_FSD_Test__8_.pdf https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/The_Dawn_... [2] https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/raw-footage.mp4 https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/raw-foota...
  • Ukv 3y ago
    > Except that it was engaged as stated in the Safety Test Report [1] and as seen in the raw footage [2]. > They are not liars because they point out FSD was not engaged in portions of the ad. They are liars because they then straight up ignored evidence to the contrary I'm not seeing evidence in video [2] contrary to the idea that FSD was not engaged in a portion of the original ad presented as being in FSD. Unless you have a timestamp that I missed, it doesn't seem to contain the relevant segment at all. I think the most likely explanation for FSD not being enabled in the ad is that the Dawn Project did the tests properly (albeit probably with some cherry-picking) then went back to film some more dramatic shots and accidentally messed up enabling FSD on one of them. I'm not sure what to make of the fact that, as Electrek points out, the speeds in video [2] don't match what they wrote in the report. Do you know if the Dawn Project acknowledged/explained either of these? > As to being unrepentant liars. Is a legitimate test demonstrating a critical safety defect in a consumer product a smear campaign? No. Have they retracted their false accusation that correctly exposing a critical safety defect is a smear campaign since they jumped the gun on their accusations before they did even a token investigation? No. Then it is a lie and they are unrepentant. On balance of probabilities I don't think the Dawn Project faked the tests, but I can see how the discrepancies (and some motivated reasoning) would lead someone to legitimately believe that they did.
    • Veserv 3y ago
      To clarify, I was stating it was engaged during the tests used to inform the test report and the campaign. The claim in the article is that "they never engaged FSD Beta during the test". That is demonstrably false. You could state: "FSD Beta was not engaged during portions of the ad footage". That is well supported. However, Fred Lambert read the Safety Test Report [1], as he pointed to specific sections, but was apparently too busy to view the raw footage linked on page 5 (unfortunately that link is now dead, but did point to the same footage I linked previously) or accept affidavits sworn under penalty of perjury before affirmatively declaring that FSD was not enabled during the referenced tests. He did not even make minimal effort to ascertain the actual truth before spouting vile and false accusations. To further add on to his point, he fabricated nonsensical justification for why it must have been disabled like: "The explanation is likely quite simple. Tesla FSD Beta still relies on map data, and this test was performed on a closed course at Willow Springs International Raceway in Rosamond, California." As a "journalist", he made no effort to ascertain the actual truth before promulgating a story. The story was venomous, throwing around the most inflammatory and sensationalist accusations possible such as claiming it was a "smear campaign" and arguing that they were either intentionally lying about the system being enabled or too stupid to do so and thus should be completely ignored. The consequences of his "journalism" are that his false accusations continue to be successfully used as ammunition to quash whistleblowing and he has made no effort to remedy his errors, making only a limp-wristed reluctant, non-retraction when confronted with the magnitude of his error that is insufficient to dispel the clear disinformation he presented as truth. As to the data in the safety report, it is corrected in the report here [2] which has live links to the raw footage. The discrepancies from the original report are immaterial as they are only slight differences in child collision speed, there exists no qualitative error, and the footage speaks for itself as a authoritative source. In any event, you can just look to the more recent tests which completely invalidate these questions anyways. The system is clearly engaged, there is no driver input, the test environment is simple, and the error is egregious and reproducible. [1] https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/The_Dawn_Project___Tesla_FSD_Test__8_.pdf https://dawnproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/The_Dawn_... [2] https://dawnproject.com/the-dawn-projects-new-advertising-campaign-highlighting-the-dangers-of-teslas-full-self-driving/ https://dawnproject.com/the-dawn-projects-new-advertising-ca...