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> Snowden is a coward Really? I don't know many cowards that do such risky things.

nwah1 2y ago
A mix of cowardice and bravery in a human way. A hero doesn't slink away to a dictatorship to save his skin. A normal person would do this. Most of us, maybe. But should we be celebrating that? And it should also make us question who benefitted from what they were doing, and maybe realize that these people were geopolitical players batting for a particular not-so-nice team rather than independent heroes for freedom.
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  A hero doesn’t martyr themselves for the satisfaction of randos. He fled a corrupt nation state that wouldn’t provide justice for disclosing the US and UK governments violating citizen rights at scale. These operations were revealed by previous whistle blowers who followed the proper procedures for reporting illegal activity. They testified in congress about it. Their claims were dismissed by the government and instead, budgets for large scale data storage and analysis facilities were approved to handle the data the NSA claimed they did not collect. The US could do the right thing. It is a choice. But other choices are made, as is tradition. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/06/edward-snowden-nsa-mass-surveillance/674315/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/06/edward-sno... https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/07/05/how-the-snowden-leaks-changed-government-surveillance https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/07/05/how-the-snowden-leak... https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/02/national-intelligence-director-apologizes-for-lying-to-congress https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/02/national-int... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clapper#Testimony_to_Congress_on_NSA_surveillance,_2013 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clapper#Testimony_to_Con... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM https://privacyinternational.org/learn/five-eyes https://privacyinternational.org/learn/five-eyes
  - mopsi 2y ago
    > He fled a corrupt nation state ... to a far worse place where he'll get executed as soon as he steps out of the line. He has become someone who says only what his handlers allow him to say. A hero doesn't prostitute himself out to a hostile foreign country.
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      Russia provides him freedom he would not have if he had stayed in the US, and has provided him that freedom for over a decade. You're blaming Snowden for the US government's catastrophic governance failures. Maybe blame the abuser/criminal instead of the victim?
      - mopsi 2y ago
        He has no freedom in Russia either. In ironic twist of fate, his is now a mouthpiece for one of the most oppressive governments on the planet. There's plenty of whistleblowers who haven't made such deal with the devil and haven't sold their soul.
        unaindz 2y ago
        And most, at least those from US or similar similar corrupt states like Australia are rotting in jail or facing prosecution.

A mix of cowardice and bravery in a human way. A hero doesn't slink away to a dictatorship to save his skin. A normal person would do this. Most of us, maybe. But should we be celebrating that? And it should also make us question who benefitted from what they were doing, and maybe realize that these people were geopolitical players batting for a particular not-so-nice team rather than independent heroes for freedom.

toomuchtodo 2y ago
A hero doesn’t martyr themselves for the satisfaction of randos. He fled a corrupt nation state that wouldn’t provide justice for disclosing the US and UK governments violating citizen rights at scale. These operations were revealed by previous whistle blowers who followed the proper procedures for reporting illegal activity. They testified in congress about it. Their claims were dismissed by the government and instead, budgets for large scale data storage and analysis facilities were approved to handle the data the NSA claimed they did not collect. The US could do the right thing. It is a choice. But other choices are made, as is tradition. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/06/edward-snowden-nsa-mass-surveillance/674315/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/06/edward-sno... https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/07/05/how-the-snowden-leaks-changed-government-surveillance https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/07/05/how-the-snowden-leak... https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/02/national-intelligence-director-apologizes-for-lying-to-congress https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/02/national-int... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clapper#Testimony_to_Congress_on_NSA_surveillance,_2013 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clapper#Testimony_to_Con... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM https://privacyinternational.org/learn/five-eyes https://privacyinternational.org/learn/five-eyes
- mopsi 2y ago
  > He fled a corrupt nation state ... to a far worse place where he'll get executed as soon as he steps out of the line. He has become someone who says only what his handlers allow him to say. A hero doesn't prostitute himself out to a hostile foreign country.
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    Russia provides him freedom he would not have if he had stayed in the US, and has provided him that freedom for over a decade. You're blaming Snowden for the US government's catastrophic governance failures. Maybe blame the abuser/criminal instead of the victim?
    - mopsi 2y ago
      He has no freedom in Russia either. In ironic twist of fate, his is now a mouthpiece for one of the most oppressive governments on the planet. There's plenty of whistleblowers who haven't made such deal with the devil and haven't sold their soul.
      - unaindz 2y ago
        And most, at least those from US or similar similar corrupt states like Australia are rotting in jail or facing prosecution.