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So, I talked to someone who had worked at AliBaba for a bit (Son Luong Ngoc) and learned a lot. Some of the 996 is related to the company campus providing every

So, I talked to someone who had worked at AliBaba for a bit (Son Luong Ngoc) and learned a lot. Some of the 996 is related to the company campus providing everything at a pretty low cost and a sort of presentism where being around is rewarded. All that plus the jobs are considered great jobs within China, and there is cut-throat performance competition process. Also, I think sleeping at work, taking a nap while waiting for something to run, or waiting on another team are encouraged. Excuse the link drop, but if you want to see some pictures of tents set up for sleeping scroll down to the bottom here: https://corecursive.com/software-world-tour-with-son-luong-ngoc/#bonus-content-from-son https://corecursive.com/software-world-tour-with-son-luong-n... To me, from Son's experience, some of it sounds like giant tech campuses in NA, but with competitiveness and cutthroat performance reviews taken to it's logical extreme. I'd love to hear your stories if you've worked at ByteDance, Alibaba, or any other similar company. What was it like? What do we get wrong from the outside? Also your experiences could be a fit for my podcast. Hit me up (see profile).

netsharc 3y ago
I feel like the Wikipedia article is demonizing the Chinese companies without enough citations of what they're asserting (I was expecting a lot of citations of how the whole thing is still being practiced in 2024...), while the reality is like what you describe, of presentism and being unproductive for a lot of time...
- readthenotes1 3y ago
  I'd wager long hours with lots of presentism is more common in human history than Taylorized factory work
lotsofpulp 3y ago
I thought everyone would have assumed this is what 996 was anyway. What else could it be? It does not seem any different than the finance/law situation in NYC.
404mm 3y ago
None of the “soft benefits” are even close justification for basically owning people’s lives. With one day of and 9-9 schedule, what is even the point of living? No time for hobbies, family or anything remotely enjoyable in life.
- adamgordonbell 3y ago
  For sure, It seems like a zero sum game that the firms encourage and then individual incentives do the rest. Like the fight to be partners at a law firm.
- xref 3y ago
  I would point out for centuries, I’m thinking at least through the Industrial Revolution, 10-16 hours was the norm and many families were still raised. And it was horrible. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-hour_day https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-hour_day

netsharc 3y ago

I feel like the Wikipedia article is demonizing the Chinese companies without enough citations of what they're asserting (I was expecting a lot of citations of how the whole thing is still being practiced in 2024...), while the reality is like what you describe, of presentism and being unproductive for a lot of time...

readthenotes1 3y ago
I'd wager long hours with lots of presentism is more common in human history than Taylorized factory work

lotsofpulp 3y ago

I thought everyone would have assumed this is what 996 was anyway. What else could it be? It does not seem any different than the finance/law situation in NYC.

404mm 3y ago

None of the “soft benefits” are even close justification for basically owning people’s lives. With one day of and 9-9 schedule, what is even the point of living? No time for hobbies, family or anything remotely enjoyable in life.

adamgordonbell 3y ago
For sure, It seems like a zero sum game that the firms encourage and then individual incentives do the rest. Like the fight to be partners at a law firm.
xref 3y ago
I would point out for centuries, I’m thinking at least through the Industrial Revolution, 10-16 hours was the norm and many families were still raised. And it was horrible. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-hour_day https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-hour_day