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It's just the start prices for batteries and evs will keep coming down. So will the electricity prices as solar prices are also falling. The space is moving too

It's just the start prices for batteries and evs will keep coming down. So will the electricity prices as solar prices are also falling. The space is moving too fast to hold any concrete opinions economics says electric will price out ice in the next 1p years for a lot of transport

alephnerd 3y ago
This is a Western point of view. Already from a financial standpoint, an EV is much cheaper than a Gas Car in India (an entry level Tata EV costs $9-10k after tax, and an entry level ICE Maruti Suzuki costs around $9-11k after tax), but everyone is holding out on buying one until the charging infrastructure is actually built. The charging network in India just doesn't exist. At most there might be 2 charging ports at a gas station, and oftentimes the station attendants just don't maintain them leading to broken chargers. Infra enhancement is happening, but it will take 4-7 years to happen. This is why Hybrids are becoming popular - the taxes on them got dropped to the same amount as an EV, and you won't face range anxiety as you can switch back to gas.
- Hypocritelefty 3y ago
  [dead]
- hunter2_ 3y ago
  > At most there might be 2 charging ports at a gas station Unless these gas stations are also 30+ minute shopping/eating destinations, the chargers ought to be places that are.
  - Karrot_Kream 3y ago
    Indian urban areas are built a lot denser than the US. 30+ minutes of driving between shopping/eating destinations isn't a concern for customers in the 3 wheeler market.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - saagarjha 3y ago
      Have you seen Delhi traffic?
      - Karrot_Kream 3y ago
        Sure, I mean that 30+ miles of driving is not a range issue. You're spending a lot of that time stuck in traffic which in an EV 3-wheeler just means you're sipping charge.
        hunter2_ 3y ago
        When I said 30+ (assuming you're still using that figure in reference to my comment; if not please ignore me) I wasn't talking about distance between places, I was talking about time spent at places.
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    > Unless these gas stations are also 30+ minute shopping/eating destinations They ain't > the chargers ought to be places that are Some are, but the maintenance issue comes up again.
- 1024core 3y ago
  > The charging network in India just doesn't exist. Would battery swapping be a viable alternative? Obviously not swapping random batteries; but those made and mainatined by the manufacturer.
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    Most likely not. Cars are the future. People prefer cars. They just can't afford them. People drive auto-rickshaws and e-rickshaws because it's both a mode of transport AND a self run business. The Indian gov and private sector players like Reliance, Tata, etc are investing in building an e-charging network, but it will take 4-7 years.
    - 1024core 3y ago
      > Cars are the future. People prefer cars. They just can't afford them. You just answered your own question: most people can't afford cars. And even if they could afford a car, where would you park them?
      - alephnerd 3y ago
        > most people can't afford cars And it's changing rapidly. Financing is much easier and salaries have grown significantly. 30 years ago, your only choices for a car were a Maruti Suzuki 800 or an Ambassador. 20 years ago car financing started in India, and multiple private sector car manufacturers like Hyundai, Toyota, Renault, etc entered the market. And over the past 15 years car ownership has grown from around 90 million cars to 330 million cars. As India grows richer, people buy cars. > where would you park them Congested street parking. Most Indian cities have some amount of space. They aren't all tiny alleys that can barely fit people Look. India and developing countries aren't Western Europe. A 2 wheeler or 3 wheeler isn't seen as prestigious - a car is the aspirational image of the middle class. Doesn't matter if it's India, Vietnam, or Indonesia - this is the mentality. What's with the gora poverty backchodi.
        1024core 3y ago
- pastage 3y ago
  Fast search days that Tata Tiago which is in that price range can charge at 18kW, still charging at 3kW-7kW should be doable and enough at most destinations.

alephnerd 3y ago

This is a Western point of view. Already from a financial standpoint, an EV is much cheaper than a Gas Car in India (an entry level Tata EV costs $9-10k after tax, and an entry level ICE Maruti Suzuki costs around $9-11k after tax), but everyone is holding out on buying one until the charging infrastructure is actually built. The charging network in India just doesn't exist. At most there might be 2 charging ports at a gas station, and oftentimes the station attendants just don't maintain them leading to broken chargers. Infra enhancement is happening, but it will take 4-7 years to happen. This is why Hybrids are becoming popular - the taxes on them got dropped to the same amount as an EV, and you won't face range anxiety as you can switch back to gas.

Hypocritelefty 3y ago
[dead]
hunter2_ 3y ago
> At most there might be 2 charging ports at a gas station Unless these gas stations are also 30+ minute shopping/eating destinations, the chargers ought to be places that are.
- Karrot_Kream 3y ago
  Indian urban areas are built a lot denser than the US. 30+ minutes of driving between shopping/eating destinations isn't a concern for customers in the 3 wheeler market.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - saagarjha 3y ago
    Have you seen Delhi traffic?
    - Karrot_Kream 3y ago
      Sure, I mean that 30+ miles of driving is not a range issue. You're spending a lot of that time stuck in traffic which in an EV 3-wheeler just means you're sipping charge.
      - hunter2_ 3y ago
        When I said 30+ (assuming you're still using that figure in reference to my comment; if not please ignore me) I wasn't talking about distance between places, I was talking about time spent at places.
- alephnerd 3y ago
  > Unless these gas stations are also 30+ minute shopping/eating destinations They ain't > the chargers ought to be places that are Some are, but the maintenance issue comes up again.
1024core 3y ago
> The charging network in India just doesn't exist. Would battery swapping be a viable alternative? Obviously not swapping random batteries; but those made and mainatined by the manufacturer.
- alephnerd 3y ago
  Most likely not. Cars are the future. People prefer cars. They just can't afford them. People drive auto-rickshaws and e-rickshaws because it's both a mode of transport AND a self run business. The Indian gov and private sector players like Reliance, Tata, etc are investing in building an e-charging network, but it will take 4-7 years.
  - 1024core 3y ago
    > Cars are the future. People prefer cars. They just can't afford them. You just answered your own question: most people can't afford cars. And even if they could afford a car, where would you park them?
    - alephnerd 3y ago
      > most people can't afford cars And it's changing rapidly. Financing is much easier and salaries have grown significantly. 30 years ago, your only choices for a car were a Maruti Suzuki 800 or an Ambassador. 20 years ago car financing started in India, and multiple private sector car manufacturers like Hyundai, Toyota, Renault, etc entered the market. And over the past 15 years car ownership has grown from around 90 million cars to 330 million cars. As India grows richer, people buy cars. > where would you park them Congested street parking. Most Indian cities have some amount of space. They aren't all tiny alleys that can barely fit people Look. India and developing countries aren't Western Europe. A 2 wheeler or 3 wheeler isn't seen as prestigious - a car is the aspirational image of the middle class. Doesn't matter if it's India, Vietnam, or Indonesia - this is the mentality. What's with the gora poverty backchodi.
      - 1024core 3y ago
pastage 3y ago
Fast search days that Tata Tiago which is in that price range can charge at 18kW, still charging at 3kW-7kW should be doable and enough at most destinations.