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I came to the opposite conclusion for the same reasons. Docker/kubernetes is fine for things that make money, but for small personal projects it is far too muc

I came to the opposite conclusion for the same reasons. Docker/kubernetes is fine for things that make money, but for small personal projects it is far too much complexity and I dumped it. pm2 gets the job done with less effort overall.

dartos 3y ago
I’ve found pm2 more complicated than docker-compose for local/self hosted small projects. Why did you prefer pm2?
- __s 3y ago
  pm2 gets past involving containers I get to rsync my code up to a server, & pm2 restart it. The server process runs like any other, no container issues to consider, just a json file saying how I'd run it myself if I wanted to tbf I'd rather replace pm2 with systemd, since I'm using it to run a Rust program, but if I was using node their cluster mode looks neat
- zarzavat 3y ago
  Honestly, I hate using docker. It’s a pain to deal with in your dev environment, especially on a Mac. It’s not lightweight for your dev machine. It requires a good internet connection and it uses a lot of data. It’s all very “enterprise”. If you’re sat in an office, you’re on a work computer, you need reproducible dev environments, probably none of that bothers you. However, if I’m working by myself, I don’t want to deal with any of that Rube Goldberg shit. I use shell scripts, ssh, rsync and pretend it’s the 00s again, and oh my god I’m so much happier in that universe.
  - dartos 3y ago
    Maybe it’s different on Mac, maybe I’m biased, but I’ve been using docker since it was a small project and I’ve never felt that enterprise cruft. It saved me from the Rube Goldberg esque pile of bash scripts and puppeteer configs of the 00s. Funny how perception changes.
    - petre 3y ago
      It uses a VM on Macs, it's usually slow and requires too much thinkering to get it to work decently. I gave up development with Linux tools on Macs, very annoying and not worth the hassle. I think it even works better in Windows since WSL. I'm using runit instead of pm2. Systemd should also do fine. It's over engineered.
      - Kab1r 3y ago
        Ironically WSL uses a VM as well
        petre 3y ago
        Of course it does, but at least it works quite decently. And you're running an actual distribution under it, so no hassles with MacPorts, Homebrew and other third party solutions for installing dependencies. If development on Snow Leopard was quite annoying, I can't imagine what it is now with the newer Apple sandboxes in place. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/compare-versions https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/compare-versio...
    - jasonjmcghee 3y ago
      I’m guessing you meant puppet (iac) not puppeteer (e2e testing)
      - dartos 3y ago
        Yes puppet! It’s been a long time.
    - zarzavat 3y ago
      It’s so much worse on a Mac. Wrong OS, wrong CPU architecture. Never had any issue with it in deployment. The other problem for me is, let’s say you’re in a hotel with crappy wifi and docker wants to download a large quantity of images, you’re in for a rough time. There’s a very sharp downwards trajectory of user experience once you leave the happy path.

dartos 3y ago

I’ve found pm2 more complicated than docker-compose for local/self hosted small projects. Why did you prefer pm2?

__s 3y ago
pm2 gets past involving containers I get to rsync my code up to a server, & pm2 restart it. The server process runs like any other, no container issues to consider, just a json file saying how I'd run it myself if I wanted to tbf I'd rather replace pm2 with systemd, since I'm using it to run a Rust program, but if I was using node their cluster mode looks neat
zarzavat 3y ago
Honestly, I hate using docker. It’s a pain to deal with in your dev environment, especially on a Mac. It’s not lightweight for your dev machine. It requires a good internet connection and it uses a lot of data. It’s all very “enterprise”. If you’re sat in an office, you’re on a work computer, you need reproducible dev environments, probably none of that bothers you. However, if I’m working by myself, I don’t want to deal with any of that Rube Goldberg shit. I use shell scripts, ssh, rsync and pretend it’s the 00s again, and oh my god I’m so much happier in that universe.
- dartos 3y ago
  Maybe it’s different on Mac, maybe I’m biased, but I’ve been using docker since it was a small project and I’ve never felt that enterprise cruft. It saved me from the Rube Goldberg esque pile of bash scripts and puppeteer configs of the 00s. Funny how perception changes.
  - petre 3y ago
    It uses a VM on Macs, it's usually slow and requires too much thinkering to get it to work decently. I gave up development with Linux tools on Macs, very annoying and not worth the hassle. I think it even works better in Windows since WSL. I'm using runit instead of pm2. Systemd should also do fine. It's over engineered.
    - Kab1r 3y ago
      Ironically WSL uses a VM as well
      - petre 3y ago
        Of course it does, but at least it works quite decently. And you're running an actual distribution under it, so no hassles with MacPorts, Homebrew and other third party solutions for installing dependencies. If development on Snow Leopard was quite annoying, I can't imagine what it is now with the newer Apple sandboxes in place. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/compare-versions https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/compare-versio...
  - jasonjmcghee 3y ago
    I’m guessing you meant puppet (iac) not puppeteer (e2e testing)
    - dartos 3y ago
      Yes puppet! It’s been a long time.
  - zarzavat 3y ago
    It’s so much worse on a Mac. Wrong OS, wrong CPU architecture. Never had any issue with it in deployment. The other problem for me is, let’s say you’re in a hotel with crappy wifi and docker wants to download a large quantity of images, you’re in for a rough time. There’s a very sharp downwards trajectory of user experience once you leave the happy path.