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It's interesting that insurers will spend money to discover this rather than rely on the pro forma clause that claims proceeding from an undisclosed risk are in
by everybodyknows 3y ago
It's interesting that insurers will spend money to discover this rather than rely on the pro forma clause that claims proceeding from an undisclosed risk are invalid. I'm guessing they calculate that a jury may not respect that part of the contract when confronted in court by grieving parents of an accident victim.
- ssl-3 3y agoHow is an unversed lay homeowner who is inexpert in the insurance industry (or perhaps even any industry) supposed to know what risks an insurer thinks are important? Their job, I think, is to accept the quote, pay the premiums, and to keep living life.
- tptacek 3y agoOn 1-3 occasions over the course of an insured's entire life, they'll be confronted with the paperwork for the insurance contract for the most expensive asset they'll ever buy. They should read it.
- Retric 3y agoAnd then remember all the relevant details for the next 30 years… It’s frankly unrealistic to expect most people to remember their home insurance asking about trampolines 15+ years ago.
- tptacek 3y agoWhat you're really saying is that it's unrealistic for buyers to know that trampolines are dangerous.
- Retric 3y agoBathtubs are dangerous, being dangerous isn’t the only criteria here.
- tptacek 3y agoOk, well, we've reached an argument that is dispositive for people who think trampolines are no more dangerous than bathtubs.
- thfuran 3y agoAnd for people who aren't deliberately missing the point.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- ssl-3 3y agoI don't see here where anyone has made any supposition that bathtubs are more dangerous than trampolines are, except for your own missive.
- Teever 3y agoWell now you've got me wondering. What does the data say? Which is more dangerous, trampolines or bathrooms? I've known a few people who have hurt themselves in the bathroom, but I dont know anyone who has hurt themselves on a trampoline.
- Retric 3y agoSomeone with both is more likely to have a bathtub related death. 341 people died by drowning in bathtubs + 70 scalding deaths + unknown number of falls vs 2 deaths from trampolines. ~3 million trampolines in the US. The risk of being sued is very different though.
- verall 3y agoI think neighbor's kid's injury rate is more relevant than general deaths-caused rate for a home liability insurance policy
- 3y ago
- everybodyknows 3y ago> They should read it. Indeed. This is how I discovered that my own policy forbade me to own a dog belonging, even in part, to any of a long list of breeds: Pit Bull, Rottweiler, Cana Presario ... IIRC German Shepherd was on the list.
- ncallaway 3y agoI wasn’t actually confronted with the paperwork. When I purchased my house, the insurerer that was selected by my bank informed me (several times) that they were unable to provide the complete coverage details and contract until after the insurance contract was in place. Even then, it took me several calls and interactions to get them to send me the actual detailed insurance contract. They tried to fob me off several times with a brief summary document. I would be surprised, based on my experience, if people are actually confronted with the paperwork as you suggest. The default flow of my home purchase made it clear that my request to review the coverage contract was so far outside the norm that they weren’t really sure how to handle it.
- jajko 3y agoNo, you have been played. Signing a contract, any contract without previously seeing it... ask any lawyer how good of an idea is that. Its doesnt matter what mumbo jumbo they come up with, if you cave to peer pressure then accept the risks. Or vote with your wallet.
- ncallaway 3y agoI didn’t sign a contract without seeing it. I didn’t sign a contract with the homeowners insurance. The bank contracted with the homeowners insurance. How could I have signed a contract without seeing it? I wouldn’t have anything to sign! But none of that was my point. My point was—if asking to see the agreement was this far outside the norm, then how many people are actually confronted with the paperwork? My guess, based on my anecdotal experience, is not many.
- radlad 3y agoYou are entitled to find your own home insurance, you do not have to use the bank's choice.
- callalex 3y agoIs that really an option when there are another dozen people bidding on the house though? (I haven’t been through the home buying process yet)
- singleshot_ 3y agoThis is good advice. One wants to be sure that one is reading the entire policy. Key words here are "certified complete copy" and once someone at the insurance company who is authorized to do so certifies a copy as complete, you can be a little more sure you're dealing with the entire thing than the "copy that happened to be attached to someone's email." The first page or so will explain who the policyholder is, what is the effective date of the policy, and what forms constitute the insurance being provided. The rest of the policy is (usually) a set of forms approved by the state insurance commissioner that define, in particular, what is and is not being insured. Be aware that something that is very clearly defined on the first page of the first form is very frequently completely contradicted by something on the fifteenth page of the thirtieth form, which makes it very important to have the complete set. In general insurance law is such that you ought to be able to read the entire policy and make sense of it - no tricks. In practice there are some wrinkles and it's good to consult a professional but if you read the policy you will at least have some awareness of the coverage you can expect.
- alistairSH 3y agoI’m assuming the insurer would ask. How old is the roof? Do you have a pool? Etc.
- hattmall 3y agoIt's up to them to make their own risk assessments. There's a lot of press when claims get denied but it's not as common or as easy as complainants make it seem. Especially when it comes to roof replacements. That's been a heavily exploited point as well. Lots of shady operators chasing storms.