3 ms·

> Fair, but two perpendicular Flatlands embedded in the same 3D space won't be able to agree on which is the fourth dimension. A lot of religious/spiritual peo

> Fair, but two perpendicular Flatlands embedded in the same 3D space won't be able to agree on which is the fourth dimension. A lot of religious/spiritual people will say that God or the metaphysical realm (some people agree, some disagree...just like certain ideas in physics) is where many higher dimensions can be found. Say what you want, but people's incorrect models of reality having more influence than "reality itself" isn't nothing (if it kills people, it's at least something[1]). Besides, almost everyone complains about it, they just don't consider it (thus it is not) dimensional, it's "just reality", kind of like how a lot of phenomena now understood due to science were(!) formerly "just reality". [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popper%27s_three_worlds https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popper%27s_three_worlds

roywiggins 3y ago
Well that's where I think the Flatland analogy is helpful, there's nothing inherently mystical about a fourth spacial dimension any more than Flatlanders ought to be worshiping us because we have one more dimension than they do.
- xanderlewis 3y ago
  > there's nothing inherently mystical about a fourth spacial dimension Weirdly enough, there are big distinctions between three and four dimensions when it comes to geometry and topology. For example: “Four is the only dimension n for which R^n can have an exotic smooth structure. R^4 has an uncountable number of exotic smooth structures; see exotic R^4.” [0] It turns out that having four dimensions really is magically different from having any other finite number. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-manifold#Special_phenomena_in_4_dimensions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-manifold#Special_phenomena_i...
  - roywiggins 3y ago
    That definitely is spooky!
  - lupire 3y ago
    Does this mean anything physical for 4-D spacetime? I'd guess yes because "manifold" is a general turn that includes the asymmetric curvature of spacetime.
- mistermann 3y ago
  I guess, but there may be (is, in my opinion) something mystical about higher non-spatial, metaphysical dimensions, and I think the difficulty one experiences conceptualizing a 4th spatial dimension can be useful in attempting to conceptualize the possibility that difficulty also exists in conceptualizing these non-spatial dimensions. Or in other words: People don't think it be like it is, but it do. http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/012/059/they-dont-think-it-be-like-it-is-but-it-do.jpg http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/012/059/the... There is also something mystical here (the "nothing"): > there's nothing inherently mystical about...

roywiggins 3y ago

Well that's where I think the Flatland analogy is helpful, there's nothing inherently mystical about a fourth spacial dimension any more than Flatlanders ought to be worshiping us because we have one more dimension than they do.

xanderlewis 3y ago
> there's nothing inherently mystical about a fourth spacial dimension Weirdly enough, there are big distinctions between three and four dimensions when it comes to geometry and topology. For example: “Four is the only dimension n for which R^n can have an exotic smooth structure. R^4 has an uncountable number of exotic smooth structures; see exotic R^4.” [0] It turns out that having four dimensions really is magically different from having any other finite number. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-manifold#Special_phenomena_in_4_dimensions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-manifold#Special_phenomena_i...
- roywiggins 3y ago
  That definitely is spooky!
- lupire 3y ago
  Does this mean anything physical for 4-D spacetime? I'd guess yes because "manifold" is a general turn that includes the asymmetric curvature of spacetime.
mistermann 3y ago
I guess, but there may be (is, in my opinion) something mystical about higher non-spatial, metaphysical dimensions, and I think the difficulty one experiences conceptualizing a 4th spatial dimension can be useful in attempting to conceptualize the possibility that difficulty also exists in conceptualizing these non-spatial dimensions. Or in other words: People don't think it be like it is, but it do. http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/012/059/they-dont-think-it-be-like-it-is-but-it-do.jpg http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/012/059/the... There is also something mystical here (the "nothing"): > there's nothing inherently mystical about...