8 ms·

> Tesla CEO Elon Musk claimed, without proof, that Reuters is “lying” in a post on his social media platform, X, and did not dispute any specific details. This

> Tesla CEO Elon Musk claimed, without proof, that Reuters is “lying” in a post on his social media platform, X, and did not dispute any specific details. This is wild to me. The CEO of the very company being discussed is saying that it is a false story and TechCrunch is saying that he made the claim without proof. But they don't call out Reuters for posting this claim with zero proof.

mvdtnz 3y ago
On one side is Reuters with "three sources familiar with the matter and company messages seen by Reuters" and the other side is the CEO with a penchant for outright lies. Neither is a particularly reliable source but I don't see any problem with Tech Crunch's framing given Musk's history of outright lying about what's happening in Tesla.
- BoorishBears 3y ago
  Yeah, what should be wild to them is that a CEO of a major company has washed their credibility so badly that their word isn't worth much more than a rumor is
- arandomusername 3y ago
  What is some of the outright lying? And let's not consider optimistic goals as lying, can you show examples of actual lying where he knew the opposite was true?
  - viraptor 3y ago
    There's quite a few lists of you're actually interested. For example https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-lists/elon-musk-twitter-zuckerberg-lies-1234808808/ https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-lists/elon-musk... Just search for them - most are verified by his tweets at the time.
    - arandomusername 3y ago
      Literally first item on your list is basically too optimistic > Talking Up Hyperloop, the (Fantasy) Transportation of the Future Another item > Saying He’d Take Tesla Private With a Tweet, Then Getting Sued for Fraud Actual tweet: “Am considering taking Tesla private at $420. Funding secured.” Which a) reads like a joke and b) didn't say he is taking, but considering. The only potential lie is wrt funding, which he still claims he had secured. > Procrastinating on an Epic Manned Mission to Mars Again, over-promising / optimistic. It's not outright lying. > Resorting to ‘Pedo’ Smears Because Someone Didn’t Like His Little Submersible Only lie, but it's more of petty insulting than outright lying, at least when it comes to with relation in business matters. > Constantly Kicking the Can Down the Road on Fully Self-Driving Teslas Again, optimistic. First 5 points addressed, and it's junk. The closest thing to him outright lying is the “Am considering taking Tesla private at $420. Funding secured.” tweet. And that's the best. The rest of the article is just whining about twitter this and that. It's a hit piece instead of an objective list of lies.
      - jrflowers 3y ago
        Check mate. He cannot have lied about Tesla if anything he says about Tesla is categorically excluded from being a lie for the purposes of this conversation.
        arandomusername 3y ago
        We are excluding optimistic promises that weren't true, because it's completely different than outright lying about what you are working on
        echoangle 3y ago
        Would you consider it lying if he made optimistic promises while knowing they were impossible?
        arandomusername 3y ago
  - jrflowers 3y ago
    This is a great question. Apropos of nothing it is important to proactively ask for the definition of lies be adjusted to exclude a large portion of his public statements, which is a very normal thing to do when discussing anyone’s honesty. That aside here is a cool website I’ve found https://elonmusk.today/ https://elonmusk.today/
  - mrkeen 3y ago
    Full self-driving
  - peutetre 3y ago
    > And let's not consider optimistic goals as lying It's no longer "optimism" when you've been telling the same lie for 10 years: https://motherfrunker.ca/fsd/ https://motherfrunker.ca/fsd/ His own self imposed deadlines were never met, even when he repeatedly changed them to new deadlines. Tesla's "full self-driving" is not and never has been full self-driving.
- asdajksah2123 3y ago
  Well unless Reuters just made up these 3 sources they aren't lying. Even if what they're claiming is false, the most likely reason is that they've been fed wrong info by their sources. But that's not what Elon is claiming. He's claiming that Reuters is knowingly printing information they know to be false.
  - arandomusername 3y ago
    Verifying sources is a huge responsibility of news networks. You can get a source for anything you want, and they should be held reliable (in terms of respect, maybe not by law) for publishing information from sources that are false. IF (and that's the IF, not saying it's the case) Tesla did not drop plans to build $25k EVs, then people should criticize reuters for getting it wrong.
VerminOctopus1 3y ago
The man has lied and mislead numerous times, kind of hard to take his word on anything
- kernal 3y ago
  Reuters has become a propaganda arm. They have no credibility.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
    Speaking of claiming things without proof...
  - peutetre 3y ago
    Here is Musk's credibility as the owner of a media company: https://mashable.com/article/elon-musk-x-twitter-ai-chatbot-grok-fake-news-trending-explore https://mashable.com/article/elon-musk-x-twitter-ai-chatbot-...
- dragontamer 3y ago
  Elon Musk didn't even deny the claims. He just released Ad Hominem. It'd be far more believable if Elon Musk could say _where_ Reuters was lying. But he's being vague because he knows he can't get specific without giving away the truth. It seems clear to me that the truth is something that Elon Musk doesn't want to say in public. No one just responds "You're Lying" in today's environment. People say *specific* things like "Model 2 is still on track for a release in 2026", or other specific kind of statement. The "Reuters is lying" post from Elon Musk is hilariously bad even at face value.
- pfannkuchen 3y ago
  He’s been wrong about self driving timeline a lot but do you really think he doesn’t believe it himself? I feel like this is actually typical of ambitious engineering projects, they are always over time and budget and whoever proposed it almost always turns out to have been over optimistic. I have been in this position myself a bunch of times, albeit at a much smaller scale of course.
TheAlchemist 3y ago
If you follow Musk and Tesla for some time, you should know that if there was even a slightest inaccuracy in Reuters claims, Musk would already be filling a 'thermonuclear lawsuit'. The fact that he just says 'Reuters is lying' means that they are 100% right.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

mvdtnz 3y ago

On one side is Reuters with "three sources familiar with the matter and company messages seen by Reuters" and the other side is the CEO with a penchant for outright lies. Neither is a particularly reliable source but I don't see any problem with Tech Crunch's framing given Musk's history of outright lying about what's happening in Tesla.

BoorishBears 3y ago
Yeah, what should be wild to them is that a CEO of a major company has washed their credibility so badly that their word isn't worth much more than a rumor is
arandomusername 3y ago
What is some of the outright lying? And let's not consider optimistic goals as lying, can you show examples of actual lying where he knew the opposite was true?
- viraptor 3y ago
  There's quite a few lists of you're actually interested. For example https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-lists/elon-musk-twitter-zuckerberg-lies-1234808808/ https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-lists/elon-musk... Just search for them - most are verified by his tweets at the time.
  - arandomusername 3y ago
    Literally first item on your list is basically too optimistic > Talking Up Hyperloop, the (Fantasy) Transportation of the Future Another item > Saying He’d Take Tesla Private With a Tweet, Then Getting Sued for Fraud Actual tweet: “Am considering taking Tesla private at $420. Funding secured.” Which a) reads like a joke and b) didn't say he is taking, but considering. The only potential lie is wrt funding, which he still claims he had secured. > Procrastinating on an Epic Manned Mission to Mars Again, over-promising / optimistic. It's not outright lying. > Resorting to ‘Pedo’ Smears Because Someone Didn’t Like His Little Submersible Only lie, but it's more of petty insulting than outright lying, at least when it comes to with relation in business matters. > Constantly Kicking the Can Down the Road on Fully Self-Driving Teslas Again, optimistic. First 5 points addressed, and it's junk. The closest thing to him outright lying is the “Am considering taking Tesla private at $420. Funding secured.” tweet. And that's the best. The rest of the article is just whining about twitter this and that. It's a hit piece instead of an objective list of lies.
    - jrflowers 3y ago
      Check mate. He cannot have lied about Tesla if anything he says about Tesla is categorically excluded from being a lie for the purposes of this conversation.
      - arandomusername 3y ago
        We are excluding optimistic promises that weren't true, because it's completely different than outright lying about what you are working on
        echoangle 3y ago
        Would you consider it lying if he made optimistic promises while knowing they were impossible?
        arandomusername 3y ago
- jrflowers 3y ago
  This is a great question. Apropos of nothing it is important to proactively ask for the definition of lies be adjusted to exclude a large portion of his public statements, which is a very normal thing to do when discussing anyone’s honesty. That aside here is a cool website I’ve found https://elonmusk.today/ https://elonmusk.today/
- mrkeen 3y ago
  Full self-driving
- peutetre 3y ago
  > And let's not consider optimistic goals as lying It's no longer "optimism" when you've been telling the same lie for 10 years: https://motherfrunker.ca/fsd/ https://motherfrunker.ca/fsd/ His own self imposed deadlines were never met, even when he repeatedly changed them to new deadlines. Tesla's "full self-driving" is not and never has been full self-driving.
asdajksah2123 3y ago
Well unless Reuters just made up these 3 sources they aren't lying. Even if what they're claiming is false, the most likely reason is that they've been fed wrong info by their sources. But that's not what Elon is claiming. He's claiming that Reuters is knowingly printing information they know to be false.
- arandomusername 3y ago
  Verifying sources is a huge responsibility of news networks. You can get a source for anything you want, and they should be held reliable (in terms of respect, maybe not by law) for publishing information from sources that are false. IF (and that's the IF, not saying it's the case) Tesla did not drop plans to build $25k EVs, then people should criticize reuters for getting it wrong.

VerminOctopus1 3y ago

The man has lied and mislead numerous times, kind of hard to take his word on anything

kernal 3y ago
Reuters has become a propaganda arm. They have no credibility.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
  Speaking of claiming things without proof...
- peutetre 3y ago
  Here is Musk's credibility as the owner of a media company: https://mashable.com/article/elon-musk-x-twitter-ai-chatbot-grok-fake-news-trending-explore https://mashable.com/article/elon-musk-x-twitter-ai-chatbot-...
dragontamer 3y ago
Elon Musk didn't even deny the claims. He just released Ad Hominem. It'd be far more believable if Elon Musk could say _where_ Reuters was lying. But he's being vague because he knows he can't get specific without giving away the truth. It seems clear to me that the truth is something that Elon Musk doesn't want to say in public. No one just responds "You're Lying" in today's environment. People say *specific* things like "Model 2 is still on track for a release in 2026", or other specific kind of statement. The "Reuters is lying" post from Elon Musk is hilariously bad even at face value.
pfannkuchen 3y ago
He’s been wrong about self driving timeline a lot but do you really think he doesn’t believe it himself? I feel like this is actually typical of ambitious engineering projects, they are always over time and budget and whoever proposed it almost always turns out to have been over optimistic. I have been in this position myself a bunch of times, albeit at a much smaller scale of course.

TheAlchemist 3y ago

If you follow Musk and Tesla for some time, you should know that if there was even a slightest inaccuracy in Reuters claims, Musk would already be filling a 'thermonuclear lawsuit'. The fact that he just says 'Reuters is lying' means that they are 100% right.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]