5 ms·

> I like the parable that any text content that originated before 2021 now has increasing value, and in certain sense became a digital equivalent of physical "L

> I like the parable that any text content that originated before 2021 now has increasing value, and in certain sense became a digital equivalent of physical "Low-background steel" It goes even deeper. If OpenAI has 100M users, and they consume let's say 10K tokens per month on average, that means 1 trillion tokens are read by the user base, who then go out and act in the world, at the very least they will read the text. The impact of AI onto the world is huge because we flock to it by the millions. Such a massive new source of text will surely influence how language is spoken and potentially support many activities, including scientific research. One of the consequences will be much wider circulation of information, as users only need to point it to the right direction and it will readily combine information across multiple fields. Recently updated AIs might be even more informed than domain specialists because nobody got time to read everything new, like LLMs, we still need most of our time for work.

myfonj 3y ago
:] By their tongue, you will know them. Tangentially related: I really loved the 'shibboleth' that went like complex and multifaceted [things] that encompass [other things] from November 2023 [1]. Even though it was clear this will soon disappear from newer models being too obvious, I was still quite surprised, that "multifaceted" didn't even get into more recent study from March 2024 [2] that pointed out skyrocketing of terms such as commendable, intricate, and meticulous. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38501589 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38501589 / https://blog.j11y.io/2023-11-22_multifaceted/ https://blog.j11y.io/2023-11-22_multifaceted/ / https://twitter.com/padolsey/status/1727555475573440996 https://twitter.com/padolsey/status/1727555475573440996 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39909692 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39909692 / https://arxiv.org/abs/2403.07183 https://arxiv.org/abs/2403.07183 / https://twitter.com/myfonj/status/1773371415149891871 https://twitter.com/myfonj/status/1773371415149891871
Solvency 3y ago
> Such a massive new source of text will surely influence how language is spoken Before chatGPT I'd see the words "it's worth noting.." maybe five times in my entire life (39 years old). I now see that stupid phrase dozens of times per day, every single day, everywhere I go. Including HN, which tosses it around even more than Reddit.
- mostlysimilar 3y ago
  AI models shit out some truly creepy and uncanny language. I know the point is coming that we truly can't spot it, but at least right now it's obvious from a mile away.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- vintermann 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure I used that phrase pre-LLMs quite a lot. Bad habit.
  - squarefoot 3y ago
    Could you please explain why to a non native English speaker? I used myself and read that phrase by others several times, also in pre-LLM era, but never occurred to me that it could have been wrong.
    - skywhopper 3y ago
      There’s nothing wrong with that phrase, and it’s definitely not “wrong”.
    - diydsp 3y ago
      it's not technically wrong. it's just not commonly used, nor well-used by ChatGpt. Good times to use the phrase are when you are teaching someone... and when it's well, important, to note a detail or fine point. It's not something you'd say at the end of practically every communication...because there aren't always fine points or exceptions worth noting. Also chatgpt has a habit of weakly editorializating almost anything as a way of covering its a*. For example, I asked it how much Jira costs, and after it told me it added: "It's important to note that pricing and plans may change over time, so I reco.." ok, sure pricing and plans may change. we kind of already guessed that. and it's not important to note it. I asked how much Flat costs and it added: "It's important to note that Flat may offer discounts or promotions from time to time, " Again, not important. And if it was important, I would just note it. I would actively utilize that in my decision-making process. "However, it's important to note that the endianess is dependent on the system architecture" Again, completely unnecessary. just say, "Endianess is dependent on system architecture." "It's important to note that the value returned by time() is in UTC." ok, yeah that's kind of important. but just say, "the value is in UTC." Like if I said to you, "It's important to note that you must press submit on a web page to return data to the server," you'd say something like, "yeah is that important though? that's just how it works?!" Like I don't need to say, "It's important to turn the key in a car." It is "important" in the sense that it's also vital or CRITICAL, or utterly essential. It's just how it's done. How it works. It's not particularly important. "Overall, the ovipositor is an important reproductive structure that enables female insects to lay their eggs " is it important? is it more important than other reproductive structures? how much more? why? aren't they all important??!? Generally, "it is important" is a convenient phrase for abdicating responsibility. It removes people or entities from the picture as well as objections. It conjures a world where question-asking isn't present, without exceptions, or context. It also hides that invisible authoritative relationship between two people. So if you want to be vaguely manipulative to people who don't think critically, you can obtain some basic compliance without overtly threatening them this way. The fact that it won't work on most people, but chatgpt batters us with it is just tiring. Furthermore, as my friend pointed out, ChatGPT works by stroking your ego and fanning its own flames. It tries to make you feel clever for using it. Telling you that what it is telling you is important is a low-grade sleazy way of inflating itself in your eyes, and also hinting to you that this information is worthy of your attention; that perhaps you can pat yourself on the back for choosing chatgpt... because it's not just random information from a google search... ChatGpt is giving you important information. don't you know.
mateo1 3y ago
Yep, and it's disconcerting how much trust people put into this system. I've got a masters in engineering and some random guy would try to argue with me about something as simple as calculating energy consumption from wattage because "chatgpt said something similar, but your answer is a little off". Articles, social media posts and photos are now often AI generated. There is going to be a certain percentage of today's students that will graduate "knowing" blatantly wrong things an LLM told them. These things will eventually make their way to books and society. One thing the scientific community never got around to accepting themselves and admitting to the public is how much of the learning is trust-based rather than fact-based. Nobody can prove everything from the ground up, you need to put your trust into your predecessors. Eventually you'll have the capacity to doubt and check a percentage of what they said, but not everything. When this circle breaks and you don't know if your lecturer is for real or just parroting LLMs we'll be in trouble. The "financialized" ultra-competitive environment of higher education doesn't help with that either.
- gandalfff 3y ago
  For what it’s worth, I’ve found using Perplexity Pro (with Claude 3 Opus) to exceed the accuracy of asking a non-expert armed with Google Search and a few minutes of time.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > One thing the scientific community never got around to accepting themselves and admitting to the public is how much of the learning is trust-based rather than fact-based. In the years I spent working with research scientists, I observed the exact opposite of this. They were acutely aware of this and it was a common topic of discussion. It's important to them because they need to be as aware of and to call out as many assumptions as possible.
  - SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
    Then perhaps only the latter part is true. Having spent time in academia myself though, my reading is that while everyone professes an epistemology that accepts its own limits, in practice everybody behaves as though they'd grasped absolute truth through divine revelation.

myfonj 3y ago

:] By their tongue, you will know them. Tangentially related: I really loved the 'shibboleth' that went like complex and multifaceted [things] that encompass [other things] from November 2023 [1]. Even though it was clear this will soon disappear from newer models being too obvious, I was still quite surprised, that "multifaceted" didn't even get into more recent study from March 2024 [2] that pointed out skyrocketing of terms such as commendable, intricate, and meticulous. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38501589 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38501589 / https://blog.j11y.io/2023-11-22_multifaceted/ https://blog.j11y.io/2023-11-22_multifaceted/ / https://twitter.com/padolsey/status/1727555475573440996 https://twitter.com/padolsey/status/1727555475573440996 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39909692 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39909692 / https://arxiv.org/abs/2403.07183 https://arxiv.org/abs/2403.07183 / https://twitter.com/myfonj/status/1773371415149891871 https://twitter.com/myfonj/status/1773371415149891871

Solvency 3y ago

> Such a massive new source of text will surely influence how language is spoken Before chatGPT I'd see the words "it's worth noting.." maybe five times in my entire life (39 years old). I now see that stupid phrase dozens of times per day, every single day, everywhere I go. Including HN, which tosses it around even more than Reddit.

mostlysimilar 3y ago
AI models shit out some truly creepy and uncanny language. I know the point is coming that we truly can't spot it, but at least right now it's obvious from a mile away.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
vintermann 3y ago
I'm pretty sure I used that phrase pre-LLMs quite a lot. Bad habit.
- squarefoot 3y ago
  Could you please explain why to a non native English speaker? I used myself and read that phrase by others several times, also in pre-LLM era, but never occurred to me that it could have been wrong.
  - skywhopper 3y ago
    There’s nothing wrong with that phrase, and it’s definitely not “wrong”.
  - diydsp 3y ago
    it's not technically wrong. it's just not commonly used, nor well-used by ChatGpt. Good times to use the phrase are when you are teaching someone... and when it's well, important, to note a detail or fine point. It's not something you'd say at the end of practically every communication...because there aren't always fine points or exceptions worth noting. Also chatgpt has a habit of weakly editorializating almost anything as a way of covering its a*. For example, I asked it how much Jira costs, and after it told me it added: "It's important to note that pricing and plans may change over time, so I reco.." ok, sure pricing and plans may change. we kind of already guessed that. and it's not important to note it. I asked how much Flat costs and it added: "It's important to note that Flat may offer discounts or promotions from time to time, " Again, not important. And if it was important, I would just note it. I would actively utilize that in my decision-making process. "However, it's important to note that the endianess is dependent on the system architecture" Again, completely unnecessary. just say, "Endianess is dependent on system architecture." "It's important to note that the value returned by time() is in UTC." ok, yeah that's kind of important. but just say, "the value is in UTC." Like if I said to you, "It's important to note that you must press submit on a web page to return data to the server," you'd say something like, "yeah is that important though? that's just how it works?!" Like I don't need to say, "It's important to turn the key in a car." It is "important" in the sense that it's also vital or CRITICAL, or utterly essential. It's just how it's done. How it works. It's not particularly important. "Overall, the ovipositor is an important reproductive structure that enables female insects to lay their eggs " is it important? is it more important than other reproductive structures? how much more? why? aren't they all important??!? Generally, "it is important" is a convenient phrase for abdicating responsibility. It removes people or entities from the picture as well as objections. It conjures a world where question-asking isn't present, without exceptions, or context. It also hides that invisible authoritative relationship between two people. So if you want to be vaguely manipulative to people who don't think critically, you can obtain some basic compliance without overtly threatening them this way. The fact that it won't work on most people, but chatgpt batters us with it is just tiring. Furthermore, as my friend pointed out, ChatGPT works by stroking your ego and fanning its own flames. It tries to make you feel clever for using it. Telling you that what it is telling you is important is a low-grade sleazy way of inflating itself in your eyes, and also hinting to you that this information is worthy of your attention; that perhaps you can pat yourself on the back for choosing chatgpt... because it's not just random information from a google search... ChatGpt is giving you important information. don't you know.

mateo1 3y ago

Yep, and it's disconcerting how much trust people put into this system. I've got a masters in engineering and some random guy would try to argue with me about something as simple as calculating energy consumption from wattage because "chatgpt said something similar, but your answer is a little off". Articles, social media posts and photos are now often AI generated. There is going to be a certain percentage of today's students that will graduate "knowing" blatantly wrong things an LLM told them. These things will eventually make their way to books and society. One thing the scientific community never got around to accepting themselves and admitting to the public is how much of the learning is trust-based rather than fact-based. Nobody can prove everything from the ground up, you need to put your trust into your predecessors. Eventually you'll have the capacity to doubt and check a percentage of what they said, but not everything. When this circle breaks and you don't know if your lecturer is for real or just parroting LLMs we'll be in trouble. The "financialized" ultra-competitive environment of higher education doesn't help with that either.

gandalfff 3y ago
For what it’s worth, I’ve found using Perplexity Pro (with Claude 3 Opus) to exceed the accuracy of asking a non-expert armed with Google Search and a few minutes of time.
JohnFen 3y ago
> One thing the scientific community never got around to accepting themselves and admitting to the public is how much of the learning is trust-based rather than fact-based. In the years I spent working with research scientists, I observed the exact opposite of this. They were acutely aware of this and it was a common topic of discussion. It's important to them because they need to be as aware of and to call out as many assumptions as possible.
- SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
  Then perhaps only the latter part is true. Having spent time in academia myself though, my reading is that while everyone professes an epistemology that accepts its own limits, in practice everybody behaves as though they'd grasped absolute truth through divine revelation.