4 ms·

Maybe I would like my games to not access my kernel? Maybe I would like my games to not bypass my firewall and VPN? Also, eBPF is not a way to shave CPU cycle

Maybe I would like my games to not access my kernel? Maybe I would like my games to not bypass my firewall and VPN? Also, eBPF is not a way to shave CPU cycles, you would use DPDK/Netmap/BSD BPF for that, it's a way to lower latency. And we're talking single digit microsecond latency, where a typical internet link has millisecond jitter.

mattnewport 3y ago
The use case is for dedicated game servers controlled by the developer running in data centers, not clients running on player's home computers.
- Galanwe 3y ago
  If we're talking server tech then why does the article claim that 10gbps is becoming retail commodity? 10,40 and 100gbps is already the baseline for servers since a decade, I have not seen a server with 1gbps NICs for anything else than remote management or off band communication in a decade. If it's for servers then the article still doesn't make any sense. See my other comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39939876 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39939876
  - gafferongames 3y ago
    CableLabs.com, the creators of the DOCSIS standard for cable modems are part of an industry wide push towards 10G internet for ISPs. According to Neilsen's law, we should see 10G internet become more common than 1G internet is today within 10 years. https://www.cablelabs.com/10g https://www.cablelabs.com/10g https://www.nngroup.com/articles/law-of-bandwidth/ https://www.nngroup.com/articles/law-of-bandwidth/
    - eqvinox 3y ago
      You're mixing server and client use cases. And you're looking at a gaussian distribution. And DOCSIS is a shared medium. Most of the world doesn't even have 100M internet: https://www.speedtest.net/global-index https://www.speedtest.net/global-index By the time your game can use even 1G per client, XDP won't even be helpful for 100G. (Which, depending on use case, it already isn't.)
      - deleted 3y ago
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      - deleted 3y ago
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      - gafferongames 3y ago
        I repeat: According to Neilsen's law, we should see 10G internet become more common than 1G internet is today within 10 years. That's a cool thing. Let's look forward to it, and the rising tide that lifts all boats. The world will be a much more connected place 10 years from now, and the 10G target from CableLabs.com as well as DSCP packet tagging, L4S and other technologies will make the internet a lot better than it is today. Why the negativity. Embrace the future :)
jstanley 3y ago
What do you mean by wanting games not to access the kernel? You don't want them making system calls full stop?

mattnewport 3y ago

The use case is for dedicated game servers controlled by the developer running in data centers, not clients running on player's home computers.

Galanwe 3y ago
If we're talking server tech then why does the article claim that 10gbps is becoming retail commodity? 10,40 and 100gbps is already the baseline for servers since a decade, I have not seen a server with 1gbps NICs for anything else than remote management or off band communication in a decade. If it's for servers then the article still doesn't make any sense. See my other comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39939876 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39939876
- gafferongames 3y ago
  CableLabs.com, the creators of the DOCSIS standard for cable modems are part of an industry wide push towards 10G internet for ISPs. According to Neilsen's law, we should see 10G internet become more common than 1G internet is today within 10 years. https://www.cablelabs.com/10g https://www.cablelabs.com/10g https://www.nngroup.com/articles/law-of-bandwidth/ https://www.nngroup.com/articles/law-of-bandwidth/
  - eqvinox 3y ago
    You're mixing server and client use cases. And you're looking at a gaussian distribution. And DOCSIS is a shared medium. Most of the world doesn't even have 100M internet: https://www.speedtest.net/global-index https://www.speedtest.net/global-index By the time your game can use even 1G per client, XDP won't even be helpful for 100G. (Which, depending on use case, it already isn't.)
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - gafferongames 3y ago
      I repeat: According to Neilsen's law, we should see 10G internet become more common than 1G internet is today within 10 years. That's a cool thing. Let's look forward to it, and the rising tide that lifts all boats. The world will be a much more connected place 10 years from now, and the 10G target from CableLabs.com as well as DSCP packet tagging, L4S and other technologies will make the internet a lot better than it is today. Why the negativity. Embrace the future :)

jstanley 3y ago

What do you mean by wanting games not to access the kernel? You don't want them making system calls full stop?