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In general, having lived and worked for extended (10 year + periods) in both the US and Europe. I find Europe have a lot more freedom, generally speaking. In so

In general, having lived and worked for extended (10 year + periods) in both the US and Europe. I find Europe have a lot more freedom, generally speaking. In some area's the US is better, and in other area's Europe is, but overall, I would tip the scale to Europe. American "freedom" have always felt to me like just pure marketing, however the same can be said for some European countries. For examples the Netherlands is not nearly as open minded and free, with lots of silly rules and regulations. However, places like Spain, Portugal, Greece, Italy etc. are actually much better in my opinion.

guappa 2y ago
I know a woman who had married a dutch and went to live in a farm there. Apparently it was frowned upon for women to wear pants in the village where they lived, and finally she divorced and left (also for other issues I presume, but she cited closed mindedness as a major one). She's in her 40s, not in her 80s.
- cesaref 2y ago
  Over here in Europe your be better off saying trousers, as suggesting it was frowned upon for women to wear pants sounds like quite a free and sexually liberated village to me :)
  - guappa 2y ago
    Where exactly do you think "the netherlands" is located?
- fransje26 2y ago
  One does not simply walk into the Bible Belt with pants on..
  - guappa 2y ago
    Well seems NL has their very own bible belt that isn't as famous.
    - fransje26 2y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_Belt_(Netherlands) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_Belt_(Netherlands)
      - guappa 2y ago
        Ah, yes I guess that's where she ended up.
fransje26 2y ago
> For examples the Netherlands is not nearly as open minded and free For a large part, it's mistaking indifference and ignorance for open-mindedness. This is not to say that there is not, at certain levels, deep societal reflections happening for an open society -with the same-sex marriage law from 2001 being an excellent case-in-point-, but, on average, philosophy and philosophical reflections are not ingrained in the dutch culture. A very current backlash of the Netherlands perhaps not being as open-minded as thought can be seen in the slightly problematic consequences of last elections. With anti-immigration parties having booked big gains, ASML is threatening to leave the country if the anti-immigration policies they promised materialize. https://www.reuters.com/technology/dutch-government-scrambling-keep-asml-netherlands-newspaper-2024-03-06/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/dutch-government-scrambli... Having already lost Unilever and Shell, this would be a terrible blow.

guappa 2y ago

I know a woman who had married a dutch and went to live in a farm there. Apparently it was frowned upon for women to wear pants in the village where they lived, and finally she divorced and left (also for other issues I presume, but she cited closed mindedness as a major one). She's in her 40s, not in her 80s.

cesaref 2y ago
Over here in Europe your be better off saying trousers, as suggesting it was frowned upon for women to wear pants sounds like quite a free and sexually liberated village to me :)
- guappa 2y ago
  Where exactly do you think "the netherlands" is located?
fransje26 2y ago
One does not simply walk into the Bible Belt with pants on..
- guappa 2y ago
  Well seems NL has their very own bible belt that isn't as famous.
  - fransje26 2y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_Belt_(Netherlands) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_Belt_(Netherlands)
    - guappa 2y ago
      Ah, yes I guess that's where she ended up.

fransje26 2y ago

> For examples the Netherlands is not nearly as open minded and free For a large part, it's mistaking indifference and ignorance for open-mindedness. This is not to say that there is not, at certain levels, deep societal reflections happening for an open society -with the same-sex marriage law from 2001 being an excellent case-in-point-, but, on average, philosophy and philosophical reflections are not ingrained in the dutch culture. A very current backlash of the Netherlands perhaps not being as open-minded as thought can be seen in the slightly problematic consequences of last elections. With anti-immigration parties having booked big gains, ASML is threatening to leave the country if the anti-immigration policies they promised materialize. https://www.reuters.com/technology/dutch-government-scrambling-keep-asml-netherlands-newspaper-2024-03-06/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/dutch-government-scrambli... Having already lost Unilever and Shell, this would be a terrible blow.