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Those boring places would be great places to hide misske carrying subs no? And hence other subs might want to engage there.

by rocqua 3y ago

jjk166 3y ago
Not really. Ships moving in high shipping areas typically aren't carrying any type of submarine detection equipment, nonetheless relay such data to an adversary who could use it, so being in waters with traffic is not really an issue. In fact it helps. If there's nothing else man made for hundreds of miles in any direction, then anything that gives off a signature is dead giveaway you're hiding a sub there. In an area with some decent traffic, a propeller that's 1000 times quieter than a normal propeller is basically indistinguishable from background noise. Likewise it's not weird to find traces of soap or industrial lubricants along shipping lanes. At the same time the regular and predictable noises of other ships are useful for navigating by passive sonar so subs don't need to give away their position to navigate. There's also more to consider than just hiding. Navies have fleets. A surface fleet can deter anti-submarine warfare activities as well as conduct anti-submarine operations of their own. This both helps submarines to better hide and helps protect them if their stealth is for whatever reason compromised. If you have a surface fleet parked in the middle of nowhere, again it is a dead giveaway that there is something of interest there. Conversely there's no reason your adversary can't sail their surface ships there. If you are going to put your submarines somewhere remote, you want it to be a place where they are reasonably safe from surface assets, like under ice sheets. There are also the practical concerns that keep other ships from passing through these areas. Remote locations are difficult to get to, difficult to resupply, and far from port facilities which are critical for maintenance and upkeep. If you're 200 miles from port and there's a problem, you can be back in port in a matter of hours. If you're 2000 miles from port it may be a week before you get help. This translates into higher operating costs for your deterrent. I'm not saying that a sub would never traverse these waters, just that shifting strategy to focus on using remote locations to hide your missile subs has a lot of cons and limited pros.

Those boring places would be great places to hide misske carrying subs no? And hence other subs might want to engage there.

by rocqua 3y ago

Those boring places would be great places to hide misske carrying subs no? And hence other subs might want to engage there.

jjk166 3y ago

Not really. Ships moving in high shipping areas typically aren't carrying any type of submarine detection equipment, nonetheless relay such data to an adversary who could use it, so being in waters with traffic is not really an issue. In fact it helps. If there's nothing else man made for hundreds of miles in any direction, then anything that gives off a signature is dead giveaway you're hiding a sub there. In an area with some decent traffic, a propeller that's 1000 times quieter than a normal propeller is basically indistinguishable from background noise. Likewise it's not weird to find traces of soap or industrial lubricants along shipping lanes. At the same time the regular and predictable noises of other ships are useful for navigating by passive sonar so subs don't need to give away their position to navigate. There's also more to consider than just hiding. Navies have fleets. A surface fleet can deter anti-submarine warfare activities as well as conduct anti-submarine operations of their own. This both helps submarines to better hide and helps protect them if their stealth is for whatever reason compromised. If you have a surface fleet parked in the middle of nowhere, again it is a dead giveaway that there is something of interest there. Conversely there's no reason your adversary can't sail their surface ships there. If you are going to put your submarines somewhere remote, you want it to be a place where they are reasonably safe from surface assets, like under ice sheets. There are also the practical concerns that keep other ships from passing through these areas. Remote locations are difficult to get to, difficult to resupply, and far from port facilities which are critical for maintenance and upkeep. If you're 200 miles from port and there's a problem, you can be back in port in a matter of hours. If you're 2000 miles from port it may be a week before you get help. This translates into higher operating costs for your deterrent. I'm not saying that a sub would never traverse these waters, just that shifting strategy to focus on using remote locations to hide your missile subs has a lot of cons and limited pros.