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> coördinates > coöperating The article has multiple instances of umlauts over the letter o. The first one I saw, figured it was a typo. But several more appe

> coördinates > coöperating The article has multiple instances of umlauts over the letter o. The first one I saw, figured it was a typo. But several more appeared. Strange, I wonder why?

aloe_falsa 3y ago
Not an umlaut, a diaeresis - it shows that the letter has its own sound (unlike the word "coop", for example). You'd generally use it for proper nouns (like Brontë or Boötes) and rare loanwords - it doesn't seem very useful for common dictionary words, since anyone who can understand the word itself probably knows how to pronounce it.
PyWoody 3y ago
Their explanation > And yet we use the diaeresis for the same reason that we use the hyphen: to keep the cow out of co-workers[0] [0] https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-curse-of-the-diaeresis https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-curse-of-...
- DFHippie 3y ago
  When I see "coworkers" I always think "cow-orkers". I don't know what orking is. It should be a thing.
- PartiallyTyped 3y ago
  I suppose to also keep the meow out of the homeöwner (ho-meow-ner)
  - schoen 3y ago
    This feels ripe for an aphorism like "you can take the cat out of the home, but you can't take the meow out of the homeowner"!
alistairSH 3y ago
Sibling comments cover the diaeresis. Its use is extremely inconsistent in English. I can't say I've ever seen it used for co-ordinate or co-operate. Usually these are typed with the hyphen or nothing. But, it's more common on some words than others - Noël, aïoli, and naïve come to mind. None would ever appear with a hyphen (at least in my experience). And zoölogical and reëlect just look WRONG to me. I don't think you'd ever use a hyphen with zoological, but might (or might not) with re-elect.
- schoen 3y ago
  > Noël, aïoli, and naïve All three of those were borrowed from French, which uses the diaeresis, so this is "just" keeping the original French spelling. > I don't think you'd ever use a hyphen with zoological, but might (or might not) with re-elect. The hyphen only works with words where the vowels came together as a result of compounding (here, adding a prefix like re- or co- to the beginning of another word that already starts with a vowel). At least in Noël and naïve, the vowels came together because French lost a <t> that was present in Latin between two vowels -- interestingly in both cases here a word related to "birth" (natalis and nativus).
keybored 3y ago
1. Test with a dictionary 2. This is the New Yorker (pretentiöus)
nkrisc 3y ago
It’s part of The New Yorker’s style guide. Their use of it is sensible, it’s just incredibly rare and not really necessary in English.
- DFHippie 3y ago
  Actually, given English's crazy spelling, it's pretty useful in English. There was a restaurant in my town -- the sign is still up but it's closed -- called "Cooper's Coop". For a while after they put their sign up I thought it was a cooperative/coöperative. If there'd been a diaresis I would have known it was the chicken coop sort of coop they had in mind.
  - schoen 3y ago
    For non-native English speakers, it's something like /ku:p/ for chickens /'koʊ.ɑp/ for cooperatives People sometimes spell the latter "co-op" (as an alternative to the New Yorker's "coöp") to make clear that it's two syllables. There's also a college merchandise shop in Cambridge, MA, called The Coop that seems to encourage people to use the chicken-oriented pronunciation as a joke. https://www.thecoop.com/our-story https://www.thecoop.com/our-story
  - scoot 3y ago
    > If there'd been a diaresis (sic) I would have known it was the chicken coop sort of coop they had in mind. Except that there wouldn't have been a diaeresis, because (chicken) coop doesn't have one.
    - DFHippie 3y ago
      True.
  - nkrisc 3y ago
    Agreed that it is useful. I meant not necessary in the sense that pretty much no English speaker will ever expect it to be used.
CalRobert 3y ago
It's a great tool for discussing sales of the eggs from your coop at the coöp. But it nearly disappeared once. https://archive.is/3Oz0F https://archive.is/3Oz0F """ We do change our style from time to time. My predecessor (and the former keeper of the comma shaker) told me that she used to pester the style editor, Hobie Weekes, who had been at the magazine since 1928, to get rid of the diaeresis. She found it fussy. She said that once, in the elevator, he told her he was on the verge of changing that style and would be sending out a memo soon. And then he died. This was in 1978. No one has had the nerve to raise the subject since. """ I am grateful it persists. As someone learning Dutch, it is VERY helpful in words like zeeën - ( zee-en - seas). Much easier to know what it is vs. zeeen. I hope it is similarly helpful for foreigners learning English.

> coördinates > coöperating The article has multiple instances of umlauts over the letter o. The first one I saw, figured it was a typo. But several more appeared. Strange, I wonder why?

aloe_falsa 3y ago

Not an umlaut, a diaeresis - it shows that the letter has its own sound (unlike the word "coop", for example). You'd generally use it for proper nouns (like Brontë or Boötes) and rare loanwords - it doesn't seem very useful for common dictionary words, since anyone who can understand the word itself probably knows how to pronounce it.

PyWoody 3y ago

Their explanation > And yet we use the diaeresis for the same reason that we use the hyphen: to keep the cow out of co-workers[0] [0] https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-curse-of-the-diaeresis https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-curse-of-...

DFHippie 3y ago
When I see "coworkers" I always think "cow-orkers". I don't know what orking is. It should be a thing.
PartiallyTyped 3y ago
I suppose to also keep the meow out of the homeöwner (ho-meow-ner)
- schoen 3y ago
  This feels ripe for an aphorism like "you can take the cat out of the home, but you can't take the meow out of the homeowner"!

alistairSH 3y ago

Sibling comments cover the diaeresis. Its use is extremely inconsistent in English. I can't say I've ever seen it used for co-ordinate or co-operate. Usually these are typed with the hyphen or nothing. But, it's more common on some words than others - Noël, aïoli, and naïve come to mind. None would ever appear with a hyphen (at least in my experience). And zoölogical and reëlect just look WRONG to me. I don't think you'd ever use a hyphen with zoological, but might (or might not) with re-elect.

schoen 3y ago
> Noël, aïoli, and naïve All three of those were borrowed from French, which uses the diaeresis, so this is "just" keeping the original French spelling. > I don't think you'd ever use a hyphen with zoological, but might (or might not) with re-elect. The hyphen only works with words where the vowels came together as a result of compounding (here, adding a prefix like re- or co- to the beginning of another word that already starts with a vowel). At least in Noël and naïve, the vowels came together because French lost a <t> that was present in Latin between two vowels -- interestingly in both cases here a word related to "birth" (natalis and nativus).

keybored 3y ago

1. Test with a dictionary 2. This is the New Yorker (pretentiöus)

nkrisc 3y ago

It’s part of The New Yorker’s style guide. Their use of it is sensible, it’s just incredibly rare and not really necessary in English.

DFHippie 3y ago
Actually, given English's crazy spelling, it's pretty useful in English. There was a restaurant in my town -- the sign is still up but it's closed -- called "Cooper's Coop". For a while after they put their sign up I thought it was a cooperative/coöperative. If there'd been a diaresis I would have known it was the chicken coop sort of coop they had in mind.
- schoen 3y ago
  For non-native English speakers, it's something like /ku:p/ for chickens /'koʊ.ɑp/ for cooperatives People sometimes spell the latter "co-op" (as an alternative to the New Yorker's "coöp") to make clear that it's two syllables. There's also a college merchandise shop in Cambridge, MA, called The Coop that seems to encourage people to use the chicken-oriented pronunciation as a joke. https://www.thecoop.com/our-story https://www.thecoop.com/our-story
- scoot 3y ago
  > If there'd been a diaresis (sic) I would have known it was the chicken coop sort of coop they had in mind. Except that there wouldn't have been a diaeresis, because (chicken) coop doesn't have one.
  - DFHippie 3y ago
    True.
- nkrisc 3y ago
  Agreed that it is useful. I meant not necessary in the sense that pretty much no English speaker will ever expect it to be used.

CalRobert 3y ago

It's a great tool for discussing sales of the eggs from your coop at the coöp. But it nearly disappeared once. https://archive.is/3Oz0F https://archive.is/3Oz0F """ We do change our style from time to time. My predecessor (and the former keeper of the comma shaker) told me that she used to pester the style editor, Hobie Weekes, who had been at the magazine since 1928, to get rid of the diaeresis. She found it fussy. She said that once, in the elevator, he told her he was on the verge of changing that style and would be sending out a memo soon. And then he died. This was in 1978. No one has had the nerve to raise the subject since. """ I am grateful it persists. As someone learning Dutch, it is VERY helpful in words like zeeën - ( zee-en - seas). Much easier to know what it is vs. zeeen. I hope it is similarly helpful for foreigners learning English.