4 ms·

>I'm ignoring that because it doesn't matter. Are you saying that our population is simply growing without places for people to stay? This conversation is poin

>I'm ignoring that because it doesn't matter. Are you saying that our population is simply growing without places for people to stay? This conversation is pointless since you don’t understand economics 101 or the law of supply and demand. That’s why you think it “doesn’t matter”… you’re missing the forest through the trees. The prices are going up because there’s a chokehold on supply… when you restrict supply and demand remains the same or increase—prices go up. This isn’t rocket surgery. Just Google the rates of homebuilding in California. It peaked in the 70s and dropped every decade since. Sure, here’s an article: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/2432071/california-home-construction-so-low-it-will-take-34-years-to-meet-current-demand/ https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/2432071/california-h... Yes, it’s great to work for a big tech company in California. But I guarantee it’s better to be a teacher or any other normal job in Denmark. Not everyone works for Google or Apple so maybe we should stop pretending like that’s all that matters…

hot_gril 3y ago
I get it. You keep talking about the demand going up like it's a given. There are plenty of states where demand is stagnant and so are prices, and that's because people don't want to live there as much. If you think the market is wrong, by all means you can show us and grab tomorrow's hot real estate in another state (or Denmark). And homebuilding peaked pretty much everywhere in America in the 1970s, as did population growth, so this isn't surprising.
- diogenescynic 3y ago
  >There are plenty of states where demand is stagnant and so are prices You mean like the Rustbelt where all their good jobs got outsourced? Yep… you might be onto something here. The difference is California is artificially restricting supply (i.e., market manipulation) by making it more difficult through zoning laws and permitting. It’s intentional. This is good for homeowners who want to pull up the ladder on the next generation (including their kids) who will be priced out. This is why jobs continue to move to Austin, TX or Raleigh, NC. Money goes where it’s treated best. California thinks it’ll never kill its golden geese, but it looks like they will. There’s a reason there was an exodus from places like the Bay Area during the pandemic and remote work—-people only live there for the income potential and once they didn’t have to, they moved as fast as they could to other places.
  - hot_gril 3y ago
    Pretty much every state has zoning laws because among other things, people in suburbs don't want huge apartment complexes popping up next to them. But not everyone has to live in the same city, and there's always more land to build on. California cities have all expanded, and I'm sure Austin has too because that place is also doing well. Because of tech HQs, Bay Area had an excessively high concentration of tech workers. You could say that it was easier to find a Java programmer than a java barista there, which was a problem because the programmer's labor was all exported. So everything tangible was expensive and/or cruddy there for no good reason, then finally remote work took off somewhat. But plenty (most? idk) of those who left the area still stayed elsewhere in CA.
    - diogenescynic 3y ago
      >Pretty much every state has zoning laws because among other things, people in suburbs don't want huge apartment complexes popping up next to them. Do you not get that it's all relative? If California was building enough homes for its population growth and now it isn't--that certainly impacts prices. This is why Japan has cheap homes--even though they have tough zoning laws. It's all a game of manipulation. Yes, other states have zoning laws, but they don't cripple new housing development. California has absurd laws that allow neighbors to challenge homes being built on empty lots or about the design choices of someone else's home. You claim to be for freedom in another comment then defend this? Which is it? Do you want an open market or not? Or are you just for what benefits you? That's fine, but be honest about it. > not everyone has to live in the same city, and there's always more land to build on This is the stupid and selfish talking again. This is why the Bay Area has workers living in Gilroy and Livermore commuting to SF and San Jose. This isn't good for anyone. San Francisco doesn't have to stay 2 stories tall... that's all a charade to prevent housing supply increasing. >But plenty (most? idk) of those who left the area still stayed elsewhere in CA. I actually don't disagree with this, but curious if you can cite anything because I had workers move to Florida, Montana, Colorado, Washington, Philadelphia, Boston, NYC, Utah... and none of them ever returned. I do think a lot stayed in California--I for one moved from SF to Burlingame and then to Sacramento then to San Diego. I do think there would be some interesting migration patterns to track.

hot_gril 3y ago

I get it. You keep talking about the demand going up like it's a given. There are plenty of states where demand is stagnant and so are prices, and that's because people don't want to live there as much. If you think the market is wrong, by all means you can show us and grab tomorrow's hot real estate in another state (or Denmark). And homebuilding peaked pretty much everywhere in America in the 1970s, as did population growth, so this isn't surprising.

diogenescynic 3y ago
>There are plenty of states where demand is stagnant and so are prices You mean like the Rustbelt where all their good jobs got outsourced? Yep… you might be onto something here. The difference is California is artificially restricting supply (i.e., market manipulation) by making it more difficult through zoning laws and permitting. It’s intentional. This is good for homeowners who want to pull up the ladder on the next generation (including their kids) who will be priced out. This is why jobs continue to move to Austin, TX or Raleigh, NC. Money goes where it’s treated best. California thinks it’ll never kill its golden geese, but it looks like they will. There’s a reason there was an exodus from places like the Bay Area during the pandemic and remote work—-people only live there for the income potential and once they didn’t have to, they moved as fast as they could to other places.
- hot_gril 3y ago
  Pretty much every state has zoning laws because among other things, people in suburbs don't want huge apartment complexes popping up next to them. But not everyone has to live in the same city, and there's always more land to build on. California cities have all expanded, and I'm sure Austin has too because that place is also doing well. Because of tech HQs, Bay Area had an excessively high concentration of tech workers. You could say that it was easier to find a Java programmer than a java barista there, which was a problem because the programmer's labor was all exported. So everything tangible was expensive and/or cruddy there for no good reason, then finally remote work took off somewhat. But plenty (most? idk) of those who left the area still stayed elsewhere in CA.
  - diogenescynic 3y ago
    >Pretty much every state has zoning laws because among other things, people in suburbs don't want huge apartment complexes popping up next to them. Do you not get that it's all relative? If California was building enough homes for its population growth and now it isn't--that certainly impacts prices. This is why Japan has cheap homes--even though they have tough zoning laws. It's all a game of manipulation. Yes, other states have zoning laws, but they don't cripple new housing development. California has absurd laws that allow neighbors to challenge homes being built on empty lots or about the design choices of someone else's home. You claim to be for freedom in another comment then defend this? Which is it? Do you want an open market or not? Or are you just for what benefits you? That's fine, but be honest about it. > not everyone has to live in the same city, and there's always more land to build on This is the stupid and selfish talking again. This is why the Bay Area has workers living in Gilroy and Livermore commuting to SF and San Jose. This isn't good for anyone. San Francisco doesn't have to stay 2 stories tall... that's all a charade to prevent housing supply increasing. >But plenty (most? idk) of those who left the area still stayed elsewhere in CA. I actually don't disagree with this, but curious if you can cite anything because I had workers move to Florida, Montana, Colorado, Washington, Philadelphia, Boston, NYC, Utah... and none of them ever returned. I do think a lot stayed in California--I for one moved from SF to Burlingame and then to Sacramento then to San Diego. I do think there would be some interesting migration patterns to track.