5 ms·

Insulin isn't a single product. If you're not distinguishing between insulin extracted from a horse circa 1922 and a modern synthetic analog, well that's just

Insulin isn't a single product. If you're not distinguishing between insulin extracted from a horse circa 1922 and a modern synthetic analog, well that's just not being honest. There's good arguments that the modern synthetic analogs are overpriced, but that's a more subtle argument.

lostlogin 3y ago
The situation described in that Lancet article doesn’t seem very subtle. And if the US is able to impose maximum pricing that is so much lower, it would seem likely that price gouging was occurring.
- pstrateman 3y ago
  The lancet 'article' doesn't actually say anything. It's just a political hack job.
zachmu 3y ago
When people complain about being forced to pay thousands a month for insulin, they're talking about the newest synthetic insulins that were developed very recently at substantial costs. They could take the older insulins for $50 a month, no one is stopping them. It's just that those older products are less convenient.
- lostlogin 3y ago
  So why is older insulin more expensive in the US than elsewhere, by a large margin? https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-insulin-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-i...
  - pstrateman 3y ago
    Only the last one makes the distinction between modern synthetics and basic insulin. Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. If you want to fix the cost of insulin products (and many other drugs) in the US you need to figure out how to make everybody else pay for the true costs. Edit: also your last source there doesn't even know what it's talking about Novolin is a generic brand name for 3 distinct products that have distinct pricing.
    - lostlogin 3y ago
      The argument that the US is paying for everyone else’s drugs is often made in defence of big pharma, but their profits make it hard to swallow. In recent times the US hasn’t really shown any other other signs of chasing socialist policy where it subsidises the rest of the world.
      - hackernewds 3y ago
        perhaps most of the research would not be incentivized in a socialist society? it's not like the talent doesn't exist elsewhere, but US embrace of capitalism is a factor in the research development research.
    - ToucanLoucan 3y ago
      > Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. Oh come the fuck on, this has been the talking point since the early 2000's. Surely nobody still believes this horse shit. Phizer by itself raked in 50 billion last year alone.
      - lostlogin 3y ago
        It comes up here in NZ every few years, as there is frustration that we aren’t paying as much as the drug companies would like. The US leaned on us hard to scrap our single payer system. This sympathy for these massive companies in this thread depressing. Big Agg and Big Tech don’t get this free pass.
tacticalturtle 3y ago
One bit of nuance here is that you cannot buy FDA approved non-human insulin in the U.S. That’s not because of an action by the FDA, but just that the manufacturers stopped selling it between 1998 and 2006: https://www.fda.gov/drugs/frequently-asked-questions-popular-topics/questions-and-answers-importing-beef-or-pork-insulin-personal-use#Q-1 https://www.fda.gov/drugs/frequently-asked-questions-popular... So your only option is to buy the modern day synthetic analogs - or illegally import the old stuff, which the FDA notes here it has the right to block, but may allow under exceptional circumstances.

lostlogin 3y ago

The situation described in that Lancet article doesn’t seem very subtle. And if the US is able to impose maximum pricing that is so much lower, it would seem likely that price gouging was occurring.

pstrateman 3y ago
The lancet 'article' doesn't actually say anything. It's just a political hack job.

zachmu 3y ago

When people complain about being forced to pay thousands a month for insulin, they're talking about the newest synthetic insulins that were developed very recently at substantial costs. They could take the older insulins for $50 a month, no one is stopping them. It's just that those older products are less convenient.

lostlogin 3y ago
So why is older insulin more expensive in the US than elsewhere, by a large margin? https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-insulin-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-i...
- pstrateman 3y ago
  Only the last one makes the distinction between modern synthetics and basic insulin. Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. If you want to fix the cost of insulin products (and many other drugs) in the US you need to figure out how to make everybody else pay for the true costs. Edit: also your last source there doesn't even know what it's talking about Novolin is a generic brand name for 3 distinct products that have distinct pricing.
  - lostlogin 3y ago
    The argument that the US is paying for everyone else’s drugs is often made in defence of big pharma, but their profits make it hard to swallow. In recent times the US hasn’t really shown any other other signs of chasing socialist policy where it subsidises the rest of the world.
    - hackernewds 3y ago
      perhaps most of the research would not be incentivized in a socialist society? it's not like the talent doesn't exist elsewhere, but US embrace of capitalism is a factor in the research development research.
  - ToucanLoucan 3y ago
    > Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. Oh come the fuck on, this has been the talking point since the early 2000's. Surely nobody still believes this horse shit. Phizer by itself raked in 50 billion last year alone.
    - lostlogin 3y ago
      It comes up here in NZ every few years, as there is frustration that we aren’t paying as much as the drug companies would like. The US leaned on us hard to scrap our single payer system. This sympathy for these massive companies in this thread depressing. Big Agg and Big Tech don’t get this free pass.

tacticalturtle 3y ago

One bit of nuance here is that you cannot buy FDA approved non-human insulin in the U.S. That’s not because of an action by the FDA, but just that the manufacturers stopped selling it between 1998 and 2006: https://www.fda.gov/drugs/frequently-asked-questions-popular-topics/questions-and-answers-importing-beef-or-pork-insulin-personal-use#Q-1 https://www.fda.gov/drugs/frequently-asked-questions-popular... So your only option is to buy the modern day synthetic analogs - or illegally import the old stuff, which the FDA notes here it has the right to block, but may allow under exceptional circumstances.