3 ms·

What? Literally anywhere outside - are you saying most kids back then hung out at arcades and minigolf regularly in their free time? We couldn't afford that. I

by speff 3y ago

What? Literally anywhere outside - are you saying most kids back then hung out at arcades and minigolf regularly in their free time? We couldn't afford that. I remember playing at the hill you're talking about - or a park - or just throwing a ball against a wall with friends when I was in the city. Also who cares if the HOA shut down that hill? Are they patrolling it? Why would the kids care about that?

ok_dad 3y ago
Did you read where I said the outside has been closed for legal reasons? In my area that was the only outside park available. It has a fence around it and are you just suggesting kids go get themselves arrested or perhaps worse for trespassing? I guess all is well as long as kids have a wall to bounce a ball off of!
- speff 3y ago
  The outside is more than that park or hill that was closed. Unless it's illegal just for kids to be outside, in which case I'd say yea that's unfortunate - but it's not the norm. Also arrested or worse for trespassing on a hill? Please. The worse they'd get is a lecture by the cops the first time.
  - ok_dad 3y ago
    Where I grew up the outside is either a a park or a vast desert with pavement everywhere and heat that literally kills several people a year. Kids had the park or nothing, but now it’s literally nothing in that area. It’s sad that people like you can’t believe the actual lived experience of someone else, as if your life is how everyone experiences the world and growing up. Not every urban area is the same. Not every rural area is the same.
    - speff 3y ago
      Please don't misrepresent what I said. I didn't say you were lying - just that it's not the norm. Most people do not live in a situation where it's a desert with pavement everywhere with deadly heat.
      - ok_dad 3y ago
        A huge number do live in those conditions, some live where it’s deadly cold, etc. The point is, telling kids just to go outside isn’t reasonable for everyone and third spaces are dying.
bilegeek 3y ago
Then the kids risk having the cops called, and the parents risk having CPS called from a neighborhood busybody. That's exactly the problem - even if the kids AND the parents are willing, the wider society makes it such an enormous hassle and risk. And there's no guarantee you'd win a legal case, especially if you can't afford to. [1]https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2018/09/05/mom-parenting-police-free-range-neglect-children-column/1156144002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2018/09/05/mom... [2]https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/13/living/feat-maryland-free-range-parenting-family-under-investigation-again/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/13/living/feat-maryland-free-ran... [3]https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/07/arrested-for-letting-a-9-year-old-play-at-the-park-alone/374436/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/07/arreste... [4]https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-mom-accused-of-leaving-kids-at-food-court-during-job-interview/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-mom-accused-of-leaving-ki...
- speff 3y ago
  I was replying to your other post, but I guess I can do it here... I would argue that there's a reason those articles were written about the incidents. They don't happen as often so when they do, news articles like to highlight the incidents and pretend that they're the norm. It's not. You posted 3 incidents of it happening - do you know how many kids are out there with parents _not_ getting harassed? A lot more I would bet.
  - tumult 3y ago
    I've seen stories like this many times, sometimes accompanied by comments from police warning parents not to abandon their children. The problem is so bad that there's a whole movement dedicated to trying to stop or reverse this trend that is making (or has already made) it culturally unacceptable to let kids go anywhere or do anything https://www.freerangekids.com/ https://www.freerangekids.com/
  - bilegeek 3y ago
    To turn your argument on it's head: are these types of articles rare because so many kids are out and about un-hassled, or are they so rare because so many people don't let their kids out enough for it to be a common occurrence? I don't know if one group or another is in the _majority_ or not. I'm also not arguing it isn't still possible for some areas - an area I live some miles away from still has kids out and about - but for a great many people, it's an issue that exists, and it's not an issue that they can easily solve on their own without moving.

by speff 3y ago

ok_dad 3y ago

Did you read where I said the outside has been closed for legal reasons? In my area that was the only outside park available. It has a fence around it and are you just suggesting kids go get themselves arrested or perhaps worse for trespassing? I guess all is well as long as kids have a wall to bounce a ball off of!

speff 3y ago
The outside is more than that park or hill that was closed. Unless it's illegal just for kids to be outside, in which case I'd say yea that's unfortunate - but it's not the norm. Also arrested or worse for trespassing on a hill? Please. The worse they'd get is a lecture by the cops the first time.
- ok_dad 3y ago
  Where I grew up the outside is either a a park or a vast desert with pavement everywhere and heat that literally kills several people a year. Kids had the park or nothing, but now it’s literally nothing in that area. It’s sad that people like you can’t believe the actual lived experience of someone else, as if your life is how everyone experiences the world and growing up. Not every urban area is the same. Not every rural area is the same.
  - speff 3y ago
    Please don't misrepresent what I said. I didn't say you were lying - just that it's not the norm. Most people do not live in a situation where it's a desert with pavement everywhere with deadly heat.
    - ok_dad 3y ago
      A huge number do live in those conditions, some live where it’s deadly cold, etc. The point is, telling kids just to go outside isn’t reasonable for everyone and third spaces are dying.

bilegeek 3y ago

Then the kids risk having the cops called, and the parents risk having CPS called from a neighborhood busybody. That's exactly the problem - even if the kids AND the parents are willing, the wider society makes it such an enormous hassle and risk. And there's no guarantee you'd win a legal case, especially if you can't afford to. [1]https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2018/09/05/mom-parenting-police-free-range-neglect-children-column/1156144002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2018/09/05/mom... [2]https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/13/living/feat-maryland-free-range-parenting-family-under-investigation-again/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2015/04/13/living/feat-maryland-free-ran... [3]https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/07/arrested-for-letting-a-9-year-old-play-at-the-park-alone/374436/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/07/arreste... [4]https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-mom-accused-of-leaving-kids-at-food-court-during-job-interview/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-mom-accused-of-leaving-ki...

speff 3y ago
I was replying to your other post, but I guess I can do it here... I would argue that there's a reason those articles were written about the incidents. They don't happen as often so when they do, news articles like to highlight the incidents and pretend that they're the norm. It's not. You posted 3 incidents of it happening - do you know how many kids are out there with parents _not_ getting harassed? A lot more I would bet.
- tumult 3y ago
  I've seen stories like this many times, sometimes accompanied by comments from police warning parents not to abandon their children. The problem is so bad that there's a whole movement dedicated to trying to stop or reverse this trend that is making (or has already made) it culturally unacceptable to let kids go anywhere or do anything https://www.freerangekids.com/ https://www.freerangekids.com/
- bilegeek 3y ago
  To turn your argument on it's head: are these types of articles rare because so many kids are out and about un-hassled, or are they so rare because so many people don't let their kids out enough for it to be a common occurrence? I don't know if one group or another is in the _majority_ or not. I'm also not arguing it isn't still possible for some areas - an area I live some miles away from still has kids out and about - but for a great many people, it's an issue that exists, and it's not an issue that they can easily solve on their own without moving.