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It will still cause financial problems for the user that currently use redis offered by those clous companies as they will 100% increase the prices to cope with

It will still cause financial problems for the user that currently use redis offered by those clous companies as they will 100% increase the prices to cope with the changes and at the same time make more money.

bilbo0s 3y ago
Then don't use redis. Lots of other cloud products you can use. There's no problem with the outlined approach.
- alephnerd 3y ago
  To add to this. If you don't want to pay a premium, there are other projects you can support. This is the same reason Postgres and Redis became extremely popular in the 2010s was because companies didn't want to pay a premium to Oracle or IBM for their DBMSes. There are other options that exist today as well. Non-paying or non-contributing users are not entitled to first class support from contributors. Similarly, contributors and projects are not entitled to users.
- jrochkind1 3y ago
  Indeed, I will probably have the choice of a fork made from open source redis, and I will choose to take it. https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launches-open-source-valkey-community https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launc...
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    Go for it! This is how innovation happens!
- bennyhill 3y ago
  According to this comment[1], redis is mostly contributions from other people. I find it pretty outrageous when I contribute code to something if the end goal is to succeed from contributions like mine in taking away the platform I was using and making a monopoly lock in on my preferred solution to my needs like Oracle. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39862021 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39862021
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    The largest contributors to Redis are either employed by Redis Labs or by major customers of Redis Labs - at least based on contribution statistics. The beauty of software is you can always choose something else.
    - bennyhill 3y ago
      At the top of the software stack it is a horror that everyone bellow you can always choose something else. Stand on your own two feet and achieve nothing or invest knowing your investments may be canceled by politics, monetization, etc. I.e. if there is too much fragments in redis alternatives, whatever skills or contributions you made you can't use in any organization because they will avoid all redis like solutions.
      - alephnerd 3y ago
        It is the job of senior Engineering leadership to take these considerations into account. Some decide to purchase, others decide to build in house, and others yet decide to design in an agnostic manner. Software is a tool used to build products. We can nerd out about a hammer all we want, but if you aren't a hammer manufacturer, a major hammer buyer, or someone who has critically contributed to the R&D of the entire hammer industry, your opinions are basically useless. I personally don't care what hammer is used so long as my house is built. If this truly irks you, you absolutely should create an alternative. > I.e. if there is too much fragments in redis alternatives, whatever skills or contributions you made you can't use in any organization because they will avoid all redis like solutions Patently false, as the proliferation of SQL and SQL-esque systems has shown.
        bennyhill 3y ago
        > Patently false, as the proliferation of SQL and SQL-esque systems has shown No, SQL is a standard that warrants many DB implementations, redia is an implementation that doesn't necessarily deserve standards.
acdha 3y ago
The ceiling is the price it costs a user to install Redis on a VM and use that instead. This seems … fair?
- Spivak 3y ago
  No it isn't, have you met managed cloud services? The price of running it on a VM is the floor.
  - acdha 3y ago
    The price of running it on a VM _including_ your real cost of supporting it is the ceiling. My point is simply that if a licensing change meant that a cloud provider had to pass on extra costs, there is a natural feedback mechanism. If AWS ElastiCache prices doubled, a lot of people would be doing the math versus whatever they pay for labor. There’s some room to grow there but it’s not infinite.

bilbo0s 3y ago

Then don't use redis. Lots of other cloud products you can use. There's no problem with the outlined approach.

alephnerd 3y ago
To add to this. If you don't want to pay a premium, there are other projects you can support. This is the same reason Postgres and Redis became extremely popular in the 2010s was because companies didn't want to pay a premium to Oracle or IBM for their DBMSes. There are other options that exist today as well. Non-paying or non-contributing users are not entitled to first class support from contributors. Similarly, contributors and projects are not entitled to users.
jrochkind1 3y ago
Indeed, I will probably have the choice of a fork made from open source redis, and I will choose to take it. https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launches-open-source-valkey-community https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launc...
- alephnerd 3y ago
  Go for it! This is how innovation happens!
bennyhill 3y ago
According to this comment[1], redis is mostly contributions from other people. I find it pretty outrageous when I contribute code to something if the end goal is to succeed from contributions like mine in taking away the platform I was using and making a monopoly lock in on my preferred solution to my needs like Oracle. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39862021 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39862021
- alephnerd 3y ago
  The largest contributors to Redis are either employed by Redis Labs or by major customers of Redis Labs - at least based on contribution statistics. The beauty of software is you can always choose something else.
  - bennyhill 3y ago
    At the top of the software stack it is a horror that everyone bellow you can always choose something else. Stand on your own two feet and achieve nothing or invest knowing your investments may be canceled by politics, monetization, etc. I.e. if there is too much fragments in redis alternatives, whatever skills or contributions you made you can't use in any organization because they will avoid all redis like solutions.
    - alephnerd 3y ago
      It is the job of senior Engineering leadership to take these considerations into account. Some decide to purchase, others decide to build in house, and others yet decide to design in an agnostic manner. Software is a tool used to build products. We can nerd out about a hammer all we want, but if you aren't a hammer manufacturer, a major hammer buyer, or someone who has critically contributed to the R&D of the entire hammer industry, your opinions are basically useless. I personally don't care what hammer is used so long as my house is built. If this truly irks you, you absolutely should create an alternative. > I.e. if there is too much fragments in redis alternatives, whatever skills or contributions you made you can't use in any organization because they will avoid all redis like solutions Patently false, as the proliferation of SQL and SQL-esque systems has shown.
      - bennyhill 3y ago
        > Patently false, as the proliferation of SQL and SQL-esque systems has shown No, SQL is a standard that warrants many DB implementations, redia is an implementation that doesn't necessarily deserve standards.

acdha 3y ago

The ceiling is the price it costs a user to install Redis on a VM and use that instead. This seems … fair?

Spivak 3y ago
No it isn't, have you met managed cloud services? The price of running it on a VM is the floor.
- acdha 3y ago
  The price of running it on a VM _including_ your real cost of supporting it is the ceiling. My point is simply that if a licensing change meant that a cloud provider had to pass on extra costs, there is a natural feedback mechanism. If AWS ElastiCache prices doubled, a lot of people would be doing the math versus whatever they pay for labor. There’s some room to grow there but it’s not infinite.