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I just want to share the change in mindset that can fix this: Water is life. Water when it falls on land you control is precious. You, plants, animals, everythi

I just want to share the change in mindset that can fix this: Water is life. Water when it falls on land you control is precious. You, plants, animals, everything needs that water. Keep it, use it, store it for later, and then when its helped you and the land only then send it on its way. And if you're worried about mosquitos that what underground reservoirs and BTI is for. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacillus_thuringiensis_israelensis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacillus_thuringiensis_israele... But really, rain barrels, storage tanks, cisterns, rain gardens, permeable concrete, tiny ponds. Rain is a blessing you don't appreciate until you don't have it, and we should do more to deal with its destructive effects than just drain it to somewhere else. Edit: I love these, they're pits in the clay filled with organic soil. https://www.thefoodscaper.com/blog/how-to-manage-rainwater-runoff-with-a-rain-garden https://www.thefoodscaper.com/blog/how-to-manage-rainwater-r...

louthy 3y ago
Not sure how your comment related to a new sewer? If you're suggesting that we need to stop the water somehow getting into the sewers in the first place, I think that's unlikely to happen by people putting out a few rain barrels. London's aging sewer network (an engineering marvel at the time it was built) has needed this upgrade for a while. For the dual reason of population growth but also the vast amount of water that we get when it rains is causing overflows into the river. One thing Britain isn't short of is water; and it looks likely to get worse with the adverse weather events that are seemingly more frequent now. Most predications are that Britain will get wetter because of climate change. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_sewer_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_sewer_system
- itsanaccount 3y ago
  > One thing Britain isn't short of is water Exact same thing is happening in the midwest of the US, where the green belt is heading east and dropping more water in less time on less area. Its not just "a few rain barrels" its literally every single property and every single development being upgraded and designed to capture and store water and let it seep into the soil before overflowing into the sewer. Not only does it make a better place to live as you generally need plants to use that water, but its the only way to capture it at scale. I live in a swamp, and right now is the time of what I call "the big slurp" where all the plants turn green, and the high water from winter that has the water table at ground level will drop 6 inches as every plant turns into a straw. It happens over 3-4 days and its wild to see. A bigger and bigger sewer is the "just one more lane" to fix traffic congestion. It doesn't work, definitely not as a singular solution. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/28/chinas-sponge-cities-are-turning-streets-green-to-combat-flooding https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/28/chinas-sponge-...
  - DamonHD 3y ago
    The area around London is fairly water stressed, indeed is in some ways a desert, amazingly AFAIK.
- DamonHD 3y ago
  Maybe part of the solution is to reduce rain/stop runoff that then overwhelms the sewage system. I understand that Thames Water may get powers to charge people (eg homeowners) a fee who have flouted regulations such as SuDS by making their surfaces impermeable and thus added to the problem, eg concreted over their front garden.
  - wongarsu 3y ago
    Allowing rainwater to seep into the ground instead of redirecting it into the nearest river to flow out into the sea is definitely important, and something previous (and current) generations have put too little effort into. At the same time this can be very hard to retrofit. Having a lawn instead of a concrete pad is only a small part, you need areas that you are willing to allow to flood in a rain event. London wasn't built with this in mind, so any significant improvement that would make improvements to the sewer system unnecessary take way too long.
  - throwway120385 3y ago
    That's what two people in the article who were quoted in opposition to each other were both saying. The difference is the London Waterkeeper guy was saying it needed to be done immediately and the Thames Tideway guy was saying that they built the tunnel to buy 60 years to do it. But they were in agreement that keeping water out of the sewer was the best way to handle it. It sounds like they just didn't know they agreed with each other.
- KineticLensman 3y ago
  > One thing Britain isn't short of is water Britain as a whole gets quite a lot of rain but it is not equally distributed [0]. Basically the western side and mountainous areas get the most (>2000mm per year) while the south east gets much less (600-700 mm per year). There is no 'national grid' for water (mechanisms for bulk movement from the wet to the dry areas). Even though the population has increased a lot there hasn't been a significant new reservoir built for decades. The south east regularly has hosepipe bans in the summer. Vast amounts are lost through leakage from the very old infrastructure, while the relatively newly privatised water companies have taken on massive debts in the process of generating shareholder value, rather than fixing things. [0] https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/weather/types-of-weather/rain/how-much-does-it-rain-in-the-uk https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/weather/typ...
- seanhunter 3y ago
  Agree. To further complicate the picture, most of London is very flat and lies between -3 and 9m of sea level[1] and we (are extremely lucky to) have a massive tidal river running smack bang through the middle of the city. We already have a massive tidal barrier that protects the city from flooding at high tides [2]. For people who don't understand the problem the tideway addresses, it's not like we just pump sewage into the river, it's that when there is a lot of rain the sewers can flood with runoff and can flood into the river. [1] https://en-gb.topographic-map.com/map-kffs8/London/?center=51.49959%2C-0.12464&zoom=11 https://en-gb.topographic-map.com/map-kffs8/London/?center=5... [2] Which is an engineering marvel and quite beautiful in my opinion. A boat trip up to see it is well worthwhile during a visit for people who want to do things that are a little unusual https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thames_Barrier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thames_Barrier

louthy 3y ago

Not sure how your comment related to a new sewer? If you're suggesting that we need to stop the water somehow getting into the sewers in the first place, I think that's unlikely to happen by people putting out a few rain barrels. London's aging sewer network (an engineering marvel at the time it was built) has needed this upgrade for a while. For the dual reason of population growth but also the vast amount of water that we get when it rains is causing overflows into the river. One thing Britain isn't short of is water; and it looks likely to get worse with the adverse weather events that are seemingly more frequent now. Most predications are that Britain will get wetter because of climate change. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_sewer_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_sewer_system

itsanaccount 3y ago
> One thing Britain isn't short of is water Exact same thing is happening in the midwest of the US, where the green belt is heading east and dropping more water in less time on less area. Its not just "a few rain barrels" its literally every single property and every single development being upgraded and designed to capture and store water and let it seep into the soil before overflowing into the sewer. Not only does it make a better place to live as you generally need plants to use that water, but its the only way to capture it at scale. I live in a swamp, and right now is the time of what I call "the big slurp" where all the plants turn green, and the high water from winter that has the water table at ground level will drop 6 inches as every plant turns into a straw. It happens over 3-4 days and its wild to see. A bigger and bigger sewer is the "just one more lane" to fix traffic congestion. It doesn't work, definitely not as a singular solution. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/28/chinas-sponge-cities-are-turning-streets-green-to-combat-flooding https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/28/chinas-sponge-...
- DamonHD 3y ago
  The area around London is fairly water stressed, indeed is in some ways a desert, amazingly AFAIK.
DamonHD 3y ago
Maybe part of the solution is to reduce rain/stop runoff that then overwhelms the sewage system. I understand that Thames Water may get powers to charge people (eg homeowners) a fee who have flouted regulations such as SuDS by making their surfaces impermeable and thus added to the problem, eg concreted over their front garden.
- wongarsu 3y ago
  Allowing rainwater to seep into the ground instead of redirecting it into the nearest river to flow out into the sea is definitely important, and something previous (and current) generations have put too little effort into. At the same time this can be very hard to retrofit. Having a lawn instead of a concrete pad is only a small part, you need areas that you are willing to allow to flood in a rain event. London wasn't built with this in mind, so any significant improvement that would make improvements to the sewer system unnecessary take way too long.
- throwway120385 3y ago
  That's what two people in the article who were quoted in opposition to each other were both saying. The difference is the London Waterkeeper guy was saying it needed to be done immediately and the Thames Tideway guy was saying that they built the tunnel to buy 60 years to do it. But they were in agreement that keeping water out of the sewer was the best way to handle it. It sounds like they just didn't know they agreed with each other.
KineticLensman 3y ago
> One thing Britain isn't short of is water Britain as a whole gets quite a lot of rain but it is not equally distributed [0]. Basically the western side and mountainous areas get the most (>2000mm per year) while the south east gets much less (600-700 mm per year). There is no 'national grid' for water (mechanisms for bulk movement from the wet to the dry areas). Even though the population has increased a lot there hasn't been a significant new reservoir built for decades. The south east regularly has hosepipe bans in the summer. Vast amounts are lost through leakage from the very old infrastructure, while the relatively newly privatised water companies have taken on massive debts in the process of generating shareholder value, rather than fixing things. [0] https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/weather/types-of-weather/rain/how-much-does-it-rain-in-the-uk https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/learn-about/weather/typ...
seanhunter 3y ago
Agree. To further complicate the picture, most of London is very flat and lies between -3 and 9m of sea level[1] and we (are extremely lucky to) have a massive tidal river running smack bang through the middle of the city. We already have a massive tidal barrier that protects the city from flooding at high tides [2]. For people who don't understand the problem the tideway addresses, it's not like we just pump sewage into the river, it's that when there is a lot of rain the sewers can flood with runoff and can flood into the river. [1] https://en-gb.topographic-map.com/map-kffs8/London/?center=51.49959%2C-0.12464&zoom=11 https://en-gb.topographic-map.com/map-kffs8/London/?center=5... [2] Which is an engineering marvel and quite beautiful in my opinion. A boat trip up to see it is well worthwhile during a visit for people who want to do things that are a little unusual https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thames_Barrier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thames_Barrier