5 ms·

>across geography Most Europeans have no idea what a "hall monitor" is and teachers don't have such obsessive control over their students use of toilet facilit

by janice1999 3y ago

>across geography Most Europeans have no idea what a "hall monitor" is and teachers don't have such obsessive control over their students use of toilet facilities. The schools I went to were not perfect and yet all students had to do was raise a hand and ask for permission to leave the classroom.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
ta988 3y ago
what's a hall monitor?
- kayodelycaon 3y ago
  A person walking around the school garbage collecting loose students and returning them to their classrooms. Or potentially sending them to the principal’s office if they are repeat offenders. At my high school, we had a city police officer doing this. (Not continuously, but she was always around looking to catch students breaking the law.) Of course this officer was fully armed with a pistol, taser, and pepper spray.
  - TheNewsIsHere 3y ago
    Where I grew up these were called "School Resource Officers" and their presence was inscrutable. Ours coached the girl's volleyball team, had his own small office, and seemingly did nothing else for virtually all four years I was there. He was there to quickly call for police presence when once a large fight broke out, but that was about it.
    - BobaFloutist 3y ago
      Their job is to cower in the bathroom in the rare event of a school shooting.
  - hedora 3y ago
    When I was a kid, they had a kid do this, not a cop. They didn’t give the kid proper training, but not a gun, taser or pepper spray. Seems reckless in hindsight. /s
    - kube-system 3y ago
      It works in some cultures. But in an increasing number of places in the US, the worst of the students abusing their time in the halls are bullies and/or violent. The students who are most likely to follow the instructions of a student hall monitor are most likely not the worst offenders.
      - hedora 3y ago
        The hall monitor simply keeps track of who is breaking the rules. Presumably, that's all the cop does. They're not perp-walking them to jail or something, right?
        kube-system 3y ago
        Students don't have any disciplinary authority over other students, nor any ability to immediately intervene when appropriate, which paraprofessionals and SROs do. And SROs absolutely do escalate to the criminal justice system (e.g. juvenile detention) when necessary. There are occasionally guns, knives, drugs, and violence in schools, and those are situations where the legal system is frequently involved. The bottom line is that a student hall monitor is going to be able to snitch on an otherwise good kid who is goofing off in the hall, but they're not going to be able to deal with more serious issues. And it would be a very bad idea to rely on them as the front-line workers for more serious issues.
  - tokai 3y ago
    Seems perfect for that school2prison pipeline.
tokai 3y ago
Yeah its very much a US thing. I remember some visiting US students that got insulted because I just got up and went to the bathroom mid seminar. The episode even got brought up during course evaluation, and the local professor was confused what the issue was.
kube-system 3y ago
Did students abuse the privilege?
- bediger4000 3y ago
  If this is a Socratic question, well, you know the answer. If it's in good faith, yes, certainly. Every privilege is abused sometimes. I fully expect to break the speed limit on the way to work today, because my car doesn't have a governor installed. Turn me in, I beg you. To address what I perceive as the issue you raise, so what? If someone needs to hit the head (nausea, diarrhea, something) they need to go. If an act of elimination takes longer than what some uptight school administrator decides is necessary, so what? We as a society tolerate some small abuse so that everything else functions well.
  - kube-system 3y ago
    It wasn't a Socratic question. I am asking if there are cultural differences that may be relevant to the situation.
- chmod775 3y ago
  I don't think many would consider it a privilege. Or maybe not having pee on their floor is a privilege the school enjoys, one that could be taken away by a student at any time. The point is that if push comes to shove, the students are going to win this one every time, so it cannot really be a privilege, can it?
  - kube-system 3y ago
    The existence of hall monitors doesn't require students to pee on the floor. I think you're trying to make a dichotomy out of something that isn't one. Using the restroom isn't a privilege, but being able to wander the halls unsupervised is.
chmod775 3y ago
Yeah. In lower grades in Germany you'd raise a hand or just get up and leave, depending on the policy of your teacher. As students turn 16-18 nobody cares about where they go anymore. At that point school becomes optional and students are there because they want to, not because they have to. Controlling their bathroom breaks would be ridiculous. At university level nobody is checking attendance anyways. You go to classes/lectures if you think you need them. There's no points awarded for the mere fact that you showed up or for anything occurring in the course of them. Here controlling bathroom breaks would be beyond farcical.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

ta988 3y ago

what's a hall monitor?

kayodelycaon 3y ago
A person walking around the school garbage collecting loose students and returning them to their classrooms. Or potentially sending them to the principal’s office if they are repeat offenders. At my high school, we had a city police officer doing this. (Not continuously, but she was always around looking to catch students breaking the law.) Of course this officer was fully armed with a pistol, taser, and pepper spray.
- TheNewsIsHere 3y ago
  Where I grew up these were called "School Resource Officers" and their presence was inscrutable. Ours coached the girl's volleyball team, had his own small office, and seemingly did nothing else for virtually all four years I was there. He was there to quickly call for police presence when once a large fight broke out, but that was about it.
  - BobaFloutist 3y ago
    Their job is to cower in the bathroom in the rare event of a school shooting.
- hedora 3y ago
  When I was a kid, they had a kid do this, not a cop. They didn’t give the kid proper training, but not a gun, taser or pepper spray. Seems reckless in hindsight. /s
  - kube-system 3y ago
    It works in some cultures. But in an increasing number of places in the US, the worst of the students abusing their time in the halls are bullies and/or violent. The students who are most likely to follow the instructions of a student hall monitor are most likely not the worst offenders.
    - hedora 3y ago
      The hall monitor simply keeps track of who is breaking the rules. Presumably, that's all the cop does. They're not perp-walking them to jail or something, right?
      - kube-system 3y ago
        Students don't have any disciplinary authority over other students, nor any ability to immediately intervene when appropriate, which paraprofessionals and SROs do. And SROs absolutely do escalate to the criminal justice system (e.g. juvenile detention) when necessary. There are occasionally guns, knives, drugs, and violence in schools, and those are situations where the legal system is frequently involved. The bottom line is that a student hall monitor is going to be able to snitch on an otherwise good kid who is goofing off in the hall, but they're not going to be able to deal with more serious issues. And it would be a very bad idea to rely on them as the front-line workers for more serious issues.
- tokai 3y ago
  Seems perfect for that school2prison pipeline.

tokai 3y ago

Yeah its very much a US thing. I remember some visiting US students that got insulted because I just got up and went to the bathroom mid seminar. The episode even got brought up during course evaluation, and the local professor was confused what the issue was.

kube-system 3y ago

Did students abuse the privilege?

bediger4000 3y ago
If this is a Socratic question, well, you know the answer. If it's in good faith, yes, certainly. Every privilege is abused sometimes. I fully expect to break the speed limit on the way to work today, because my car doesn't have a governor installed. Turn me in, I beg you. To address what I perceive as the issue you raise, so what? If someone needs to hit the head (nausea, diarrhea, something) they need to go. If an act of elimination takes longer than what some uptight school administrator decides is necessary, so what? We as a society tolerate some small abuse so that everything else functions well.
- kube-system 3y ago
  It wasn't a Socratic question. I am asking if there are cultural differences that may be relevant to the situation.
chmod775 3y ago
I don't think many would consider it a privilege. Or maybe not having pee on their floor is a privilege the school enjoys, one that could be taken away by a student at any time. The point is that if push comes to shove, the students are going to win this one every time, so it cannot really be a privilege, can it?
- kube-system 3y ago
  The existence of hall monitors doesn't require students to pee on the floor. I think you're trying to make a dichotomy out of something that isn't one. Using the restroom isn't a privilege, but being able to wander the halls unsupervised is.

chmod775 3y ago

Yeah. In lower grades in Germany you'd raise a hand or just get up and leave, depending on the policy of your teacher. As students turn 16-18 nobody cares about where they go anymore. At that point school becomes optional and students are there because they want to, not because they have to. Controlling their bathroom breaks would be ridiculous. At university level nobody is checking attendance anyways. You go to classes/lectures if you think you need them. There's no points awarded for the mere fact that you showed up or for anything occurring in the course of them. Here controlling bathroom breaks would be beyond farcical.