3 ms·

Do "we" really have a choice? As individuals, granted. But as a species, there is no mechanism to actually arrive at a decision which would result in a partic

by lynx23 3y ago

Do "we" really have a choice? As individuals, granted. But as a species, there is no mechanism to actually arrive at a decision which would result in a particular choice being made.

wolverine876 3y ago
> as a species, there is no mechanism to actually arrive at a decision which would result in a particular choice being made. We make choices like that regularly, in fact. We're a social species and organize ourselves, make rules, make large scale decisions through government. People love to indulge this odd fantasy of powerlessness - it's very convenient for those who want to make the decisions for everyone else.
b112 3y ago
It's OK, for species wide compliance we have war. * We can go to general, world wide conventional war. Just the amount of oil and environmental damage spent, producing machines (eg, airplanes, tanks, missiles, ships) would be astronomical * Nuclear war would likely break out at some point, when someone is backed into a corner * Biological warfare will likely be a component of any large scale future war. Naturally, mistakes will be made, and one favourite is destroying an enemy's food supplies. So imagine crops or food animals targeted by disease, and it spreads to other lifeforms My point is, I have been wondering that when things get very very visibly bad, when no one can rationalize away what is happening, when everything is falling apart due to global migration, land loss, loss of crop land, etc etc... Will war then occur, with "pro environmental" nations working to prevent environmental damage of others? And then, of course, causing waaay more damage due to the war? Because, well, humans.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  You should write some dystopian books. You can see that, through democratic governance, we have managed many problems and crises. The problem is when people undermine democracy - either to grab power, or to act out on frustration and hopelessness. Nothing is stopping us from solving these problems, except hopelessness.

by lynx23 3y ago

Do "we" really have a choice? As individuals, granted. But as a species, there is no mechanism to actually arrive at a decision which would result in a particular choice being made.

wolverine876 3y ago

> as a species, there is no mechanism to actually arrive at a decision which would result in a particular choice being made. We make choices like that regularly, in fact. We're a social species and organize ourselves, make rules, make large scale decisions through government. People love to indulge this odd fantasy of powerlessness - it's very convenient for those who want to make the decisions for everyone else.

b112 3y ago

It's OK, for species wide compliance we have war. * We can go to general, world wide conventional war. Just the amount of oil and environmental damage spent, producing machines (eg, airplanes, tanks, missiles, ships) would be astronomical * Nuclear war would likely break out at some point, when someone is backed into a corner * Biological warfare will likely be a component of any large scale future war. Naturally, mistakes will be made, and one favourite is destroying an enemy's food supplies. So imagine crops or food animals targeted by disease, and it spreads to other lifeforms My point is, I have been wondering that when things get very very visibly bad, when no one can rationalize away what is happening, when everything is falling apart due to global migration, land loss, loss of crop land, etc etc... Will war then occur, with "pro environmental" nations working to prevent environmental damage of others? And then, of course, causing waaay more damage due to the war? Because, well, humans.

wolverine876 3y ago
You should write some dystopian books. You can see that, through democratic governance, we have managed many problems and crises. The problem is when people undermine democracy - either to grab power, or to act out on frustration and hopelessness. Nothing is stopping us from solving these problems, except hopelessness.