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“Charles Darwin found the example of the Ichneumonidae so troubling that it contributed to his increasing doubts about the nature and existence of a Creator” h

“Charles Darwin found the example of the Ichneumonidae so troubling that it contributed to his increasing doubts about the nature and existence of a Creator” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichneumonidae https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichneumonidae

Liquix 3y ago
“I cannot persuade myself that a beneficent and omnipotent God would have designedly created the Ichneumonidae with the express intention of their feeding within the living bodies of caterpillars.” - Darwin
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  I've never understood this argument. Abrahamic god is pretty clearly okay with suffering and torture and murder. He was pretty clear to certain tribes of jews that they should murder certain other tribes of jews, and if you are islamic, he is very clear you should kill nonbelievers, to the point of full scale war. God also gave mankind "dominion" over animals, up to and including murdering them for food, so killing something for food has significant "Okay" precedent. God does not limit suffering people or animals experience. He has the utmost ability to do exactly that if he wanted, but seemingly he has taken a hands off approach, at least since about the 1600s. I guess he's not that bothered by immense suffering. And why should he be? He made us in his image, whatever that's supposed to mean, but we also are not meant to understand his ways. Why would such a supernatural being care about the suffering of some toy creatures he made? Do you feel bad when you play action figures and one of them drowns?
- bspammer 3y ago
  The full letter that this is quoted from is available here, it's wonderful writing (3rd and 4th paragraph): https://www.darwinproject.ac.uk/letter/DCP-LETT-2814.xml https://www.darwinproject.ac.uk/letter/DCP-LETT-2814.xml I have to admit I've never read any Darwin before, but in those 2 paragraphs he completely summarizes my feelings about the natural world.

Liquix 3y ago

“I cannot persuade myself that a beneficent and omnipotent God would have designedly created the Ichneumonidae with the express intention of their feeding within the living bodies of caterpillars.” - Darwin

mrguyorama 3y ago
I've never understood this argument. Abrahamic god is pretty clearly okay with suffering and torture and murder. He was pretty clear to certain tribes of jews that they should murder certain other tribes of jews, and if you are islamic, he is very clear you should kill nonbelievers, to the point of full scale war. God also gave mankind "dominion" over animals, up to and including murdering them for food, so killing something for food has significant "Okay" precedent. God does not limit suffering people or animals experience. He has the utmost ability to do exactly that if he wanted, but seemingly he has taken a hands off approach, at least since about the 1600s. I guess he's not that bothered by immense suffering. And why should he be? He made us in his image, whatever that's supposed to mean, but we also are not meant to understand his ways. Why would such a supernatural being care about the suffering of some toy creatures he made? Do you feel bad when you play action figures and one of them drowns?
bspammer 3y ago
The full letter that this is quoted from is available here, it's wonderful writing (3rd and 4th paragraph): https://www.darwinproject.ac.uk/letter/DCP-LETT-2814.xml https://www.darwinproject.ac.uk/letter/DCP-LETT-2814.xml I have to admit I've never read any Darwin before, but in those 2 paragraphs he completely summarizes my feelings about the natural world.