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I'd unironically support raising the voting age in the US to 25. I was an idiot when I was 18 and had no business picking a leader of any kind. There's someth

I'd unironically support raising the voting age in the US to 25. I was an idiot when I was 18 and had no business picking a leader of any kind. There's something to be said for waiting until people have actual life experience.

vsnf 3y ago
I have the opposite take you have. There should be no restriction on voting age at all. Everyone possesses the right to have a say in the direction of the government that governs them.
- 2024throwaway 3y ago
  Riiiight. Because four year olds have a strong grasp on current events and deserve a say, and totally wouldn’t just become an extra vote for whomever their parents are voting for.
  - vsnf 3y ago
    Yep, I understand the practical issues with my position. But I can’t ethically condone saying “you have no voice” to a fellow citizen, so I prefer no restrictions.
    - 2024throwaway 3y ago
      I can’t ethically say that policy should be decided by people whose primary concern is the frequency of nap and snack time.
    - jl6 3y ago
      There are plenty of unethical outcomes available in the "let babies vote" scenario, to weigh against the allegedly-unethical scenario of having a voting age.
      - vsnf 3y ago
        Indeed there are. There are many hills I’ll die on, and while this isn’t one of them, I do find it deeply uncomfortable to so clearly deny a whole category of citizens representation.
        jl6 3y ago
        Why so uncomfortable though? We routinely stop children doing all kinds of things, for exactly the same reason (lack of maturity in decision-making).
        kelseyfrog 3y ago
        Maybe that's an opportunity to reevaluate those restrictions rather than make the argument that because restrictions exist that one is as good as another. It's about as logical as saying, "we put people in jail, therefore it's ok that you go to jail." The nuance and reasoning is the point.
        2024throwaway 3y ago
        Alright let's do that. Is disallowing children from driving vehicles or purchasing and consuming alcohol a bad idea? My conclusion: No. Children should not be able to do those things. Therefore, there are likely other things they should not be allowed to do. I honestly can't believe we're even having this discussion.
        kelseyfrog 3y ago
        I can't believe we're not having this discussion. The driving example is a bit disingenuous because, in the US at least, driving isn't conceptualized as a "right" - it's formulated as a privilege. The drinking example is closer, but that's the right to self-determination. I don't suspect that you believe children have zero self-determination, nor do I suspect that you believe that one person's right to vote should be based on everyone in a particular class. It would be unconscionable to say, "Women shouldn't be allowed to vote because some women can't make good decisions." I simply extend the same unconscionablity to children.
    - kcplate 3y ago
      Whose voice does the 4 year old have? Theirs or their parents? What you do by opening the vote to children below a certain age is all you are doing is amplifying the vote of the parents, you are not giving voice to the children. At what age does the child who can vote actually have the capacity to choose their candidate and are even able to negotiate the mechanics of voting? Let’s say 18 is too old, but how young before they are able to counter the influence of a parent and decide for themselves…I’d argue its at least well into their teens.
  - dnissley 3y ago
    You'll be aghast as to what the average 44 year old believes then
dotnet00 3y ago
You aren't going to gain life experience before the age if you keep raising the age of being allowed to live life to match that age. I know you're specifically referring to voting age, but just making a general observation on how everyone seems to only want to keep increasing these various arbitrary age gates as if simply being older is all it takes. Have you guys all forgotten when you went through these points? I still distinctly remember how glaringly stupid I realized the world was when I had to take a waiver notice to my university dorm room and sign as my dad a few days before turning 18, and that just a few days later I'd be fine to sign it as myself, despite obviously not changing much in a few days. Either way I had been living at a university thousands of miles from my parents for nearly 2 years and had said as much, so it was a farce all around. Similarly with turning 21 and being allowed to drink.
keybored 3y ago
Obviously the US needs more mature voters. To match the very mature leaders (“”) who are so mature that they have symptoms of senility or die on the job while their helpers vote for them.
adrr 3y ago
Should we put age limit on voting? 70 doesn’t have the brain functionality of an 18 year old. Why they are very susceptible to fraud because of cognitive decline.
- smileysteve 3y ago
  I think we should limit voting to those who block ads!
patrickmay 3y ago
I support that idea because I think you should be in the work force and experience both taxation and laws personally before voting on them.
- itishappy 3y ago
  Believe it or not, our laws apply to children too! Other government programs that can affect children include schools, roads, libraries, healthcare, welfare... They're personally affected by a lot of political stuff. While we're at it, why should adults be the ones deciding how the public school system works? It's been more than 10 years since I was in school, I doubt my experience is still relevant.
renewiltord 3y ago
Personally, I think we should set the voting age to 35 and cut off everyone above 37. It’s too risky to let the old or young vote. We can raise both thresholds by one per year to account for inflation.
rchaud 3y ago
In that case most of Congress should recuse themselves from voting on abortion bills considering they've been shooting blanks and having hot flashes since the 90s. That you were not fully informed when you voted at 18 is not a reason to restrict the rights of others who are. Or aren't. Who's to say a 25yo is somehow any better prepared to vote? It's not like they were asked to pass a civics test first.
kccoder 3y ago
Plenty of "idiots" outside the age range of 18-25, should we restrict them as well? How would we determine who is qualified to vote? Any other rights provided by the constitution you'd like to alter while we're at it? What other responsibilities available 18-25 year olds would you like to restrict? The draft, driving a vehicle, taking out loans, ...? Perhaps they shouldn't be allowed to choose their own clothing, what food they eat, ...

vsnf 3y ago

I have the opposite take you have. There should be no restriction on voting age at all. Everyone possesses the right to have a say in the direction of the government that governs them.

2024throwaway 3y ago
Riiiight. Because four year olds have a strong grasp on current events and deserve a say, and totally wouldn’t just become an extra vote for whomever their parents are voting for.
- vsnf 3y ago
  Yep, I understand the practical issues with my position. But I can’t ethically condone saying “you have no voice” to a fellow citizen, so I prefer no restrictions.
  - 2024throwaway 3y ago
    I can’t ethically say that policy should be decided by people whose primary concern is the frequency of nap and snack time.
  - jl6 3y ago
    There are plenty of unethical outcomes available in the "let babies vote" scenario, to weigh against the allegedly-unethical scenario of having a voting age.
    - vsnf 3y ago
      Indeed there are. There are many hills I’ll die on, and while this isn’t one of them, I do find it deeply uncomfortable to so clearly deny a whole category of citizens representation.
      - jl6 3y ago
        Why so uncomfortable though? We routinely stop children doing all kinds of things, for exactly the same reason (lack of maturity in decision-making).
        kelseyfrog 3y ago
        Maybe that's an opportunity to reevaluate those restrictions rather than make the argument that because restrictions exist that one is as good as another. It's about as logical as saying, "we put people in jail, therefore it's ok that you go to jail." The nuance and reasoning is the point.
        2024throwaway 3y ago
        Alright let's do that. Is disallowing children from driving vehicles or purchasing and consuming alcohol a bad idea? My conclusion: No. Children should not be able to do those things. Therefore, there are likely other things they should not be allowed to do. I honestly can't believe we're even having this discussion.
        kelseyfrog 3y ago
        I can't believe we're not having this discussion. The driving example is a bit disingenuous because, in the US at least, driving isn't conceptualized as a "right" - it's formulated as a privilege. The drinking example is closer, but that's the right to self-determination. I don't suspect that you believe children have zero self-determination, nor do I suspect that you believe that one person's right to vote should be based on everyone in a particular class. It would be unconscionable to say, "Women shouldn't be allowed to vote because some women can't make good decisions." I simply extend the same unconscionablity to children.
  - kcplate 3y ago
    Whose voice does the 4 year old have? Theirs or their parents? What you do by opening the vote to children below a certain age is all you are doing is amplifying the vote of the parents, you are not giving voice to the children. At what age does the child who can vote actually have the capacity to choose their candidate and are even able to negotiate the mechanics of voting? Let’s say 18 is too old, but how young before they are able to counter the influence of a parent and decide for themselves…I’d argue its at least well into their teens.
- dnissley 3y ago
  You'll be aghast as to what the average 44 year old believes then

dotnet00 3y ago

You aren't going to gain life experience before the age if you keep raising the age of being allowed to live life to match that age. I know you're specifically referring to voting age, but just making a general observation on how everyone seems to only want to keep increasing these various arbitrary age gates as if simply being older is all it takes. Have you guys all forgotten when you went through these points? I still distinctly remember how glaringly stupid I realized the world was when I had to take a waiver notice to my university dorm room and sign as my dad a few days before turning 18, and that just a few days later I'd be fine to sign it as myself, despite obviously not changing much in a few days. Either way I had been living at a university thousands of miles from my parents for nearly 2 years and had said as much, so it was a farce all around. Similarly with turning 21 and being allowed to drink.

keybored 3y ago

Obviously the US needs more mature voters. To match the very mature leaders (“”) who are so mature that they have symptoms of senility or die on the job while their helpers vote for them.

adrr 3y ago

Should we put age limit on voting? 70 doesn’t have the brain functionality of an 18 year old. Why they are very susceptible to fraud because of cognitive decline.

smileysteve 3y ago
I think we should limit voting to those who block ads!

patrickmay 3y ago

I support that idea because I think you should be in the work force and experience both taxation and laws personally before voting on them.

itishappy 3y ago
Believe it or not, our laws apply to children too! Other government programs that can affect children include schools, roads, libraries, healthcare, welfare... They're personally affected by a lot of political stuff. While we're at it, why should adults be the ones deciding how the public school system works? It's been more than 10 years since I was in school, I doubt my experience is still relevant.

renewiltord 3y ago

Personally, I think we should set the voting age to 35 and cut off everyone above 37. It’s too risky to let the old or young vote. We can raise both thresholds by one per year to account for inflation.

rchaud 3y ago

In that case most of Congress should recuse themselves from voting on abortion bills considering they've been shooting blanks and having hot flashes since the 90s. That you were not fully informed when you voted at 18 is not a reason to restrict the rights of others who are. Or aren't. Who's to say a 25yo is somehow any better prepared to vote? It's not like they were asked to pass a civics test first.

kccoder 3y ago

Plenty of "idiots" outside the age range of 18-25, should we restrict them as well? How would we determine who is qualified to vote? Any other rights provided by the constitution you'd like to alter while we're at it? What other responsibilities available 18-25 year olds would you like to restrict? The draft, driving a vehicle, taking out loans, ...? Perhaps they shouldn't be allowed to choose their own clothing, what food they eat, ...