4 ms·

MacOS creates so many normalization problems in mixed environments that it's not even funny any more. No common server-side CMS etc. can deal with it, so the mo

MacOS creates so many normalization problems in mixed environments that it's not even funny any more. No common server-side CMS etc. can deal with it, so the more Macs you add to an organization, the more problems you get with inconsistent normalization in your content. (And indeed, CMSes shouldn't have to second-guess users' intentions - diacretics and umlauts are pronounced differently and I should be able to encode that difference, e.g. to better cue TTS.) And, of course, the Apple fanboys will just shrug and suggest you also convert the rest of the organization to Apple devices, after all, if Apple made a choice, it can't be wrong.

fauigerzigerk 3y ago
I'm not sure I understand. On the one hand you seem to be saying that users should be able to choose which normalisation form to use (not sure why). On the other hand you're unhappy about macOS sending NFD. If it's a user choice then CMSs have to be able to deal with all normalisation forms anyway and shouldn't care one bit whether macOS sends NFD or NFC. Mac users could of course complain about their choice not being honoured by macOS but that's of no concern to CMSs.
- creshal 3y ago
  > On the other hand you're unhappy about macOS sending NFD. Because MacOS always uses it, regardless of the user's intention, so it decomposes umlauts into diaereses (despite them having different meanings and pronunciations) and mangles cyrillic, and probably more problems I haven't yet run into.
  - kps 3y ago
    Unicode doesn't have ‘umlauts’, and (with a few unfortunate exceptions) doesn't care about meanings and pronunciations. From the Unicode perspective, what you're talking about is the difference between Unicode Normalization Form C: U+00FC LATIN SMALL LETTER U WITH DIAERESIS and Unicode Normalization Form D: U+0075 LATIN SMALL LETTER U U+0308 COMBINING DIAERESIS Unicode calls these two forms ‘canonically equivalent’.
zh3 3y ago
Suspect you're getting downvoted because of the last sentence. However, I do sympathise with MacOS tending to mangle standard (even plain ASCII) text in a way that adds to the workload for users of other OS's.
- creshal 3y ago
  It adds to the workload of everyone, including the Apple users. The latter ones are just in denial about it.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
cozzyd 3y ago
For maximum pain, they should start populating folders with .DS_STÖRE
- eviks 3y ago
  But store decomposed form on Tuesdays!

fauigerzigerk 3y ago

I'm not sure I understand. On the one hand you seem to be saying that users should be able to choose which normalisation form to use (not sure why). On the other hand you're unhappy about macOS sending NFD. If it's a user choice then CMSs have to be able to deal with all normalisation forms anyway and shouldn't care one bit whether macOS sends NFD or NFC. Mac users could of course complain about their choice not being honoured by macOS but that's of no concern to CMSs.

creshal 3y ago
> On the other hand you're unhappy about macOS sending NFD. Because MacOS always uses it, regardless of the user's intention, so it decomposes umlauts into diaereses (despite them having different meanings and pronunciations) and mangles cyrillic, and probably more problems I haven't yet run into.
- kps 3y ago
  Unicode doesn't have ‘umlauts’, and (with a few unfortunate exceptions) doesn't care about meanings and pronunciations. From the Unicode perspective, what you're talking about is the difference between Unicode Normalization Form C: U+00FC LATIN SMALL LETTER U WITH DIAERESIS and Unicode Normalization Form D: U+0075 LATIN SMALL LETTER U U+0308 COMBINING DIAERESIS Unicode calls these two forms ‘canonically equivalent’.

zh3 3y ago

Suspect you're getting downvoted because of the last sentence. However, I do sympathise with MacOS tending to mangle standard (even plain ASCII) text in a way that adds to the workload for users of other OS's.

creshal 3y ago
It adds to the workload of everyone, including the Apple users. The latter ones are just in denial about it.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

cozzyd 3y ago

For maximum pain, they should start populating folders with .DS_STÖRE

eviks 3y ago
But store decomposed form on Tuesdays!