8 ms·

Oh I hope this is true. I sit here seven months after Google released the source to ICS, and still the T-Mobile Samsung Galaxy S II has not been upgraded to An

by jerrya 14y ago

Oh I hope this is true. I sit here seven months after Google released the source to ICS, and still the T-Mobile Samsung Galaxy S II has not been upgraded to Android 4.0, and today the rumor is it will be at least another month before TMo and Samsung can get their act together. Android may have lots of Google induced issues, but it certainly seems that 90% of the issues most users have comes from terrible carrier bloatware and infrequent, late, or just never occurring carrier updates.

jrockway 14y ago
I agree completely. Fragmentation isn't something Google wants; we waste a ton of engineering effort supporting old devices. For example, Google Wallet has to support Gingerbread for at least two years because one carrier won't upgrade their Nexus S to Ice Cream Sandwich. That's one extra test run for every commit for two years, eating up thousands of hours of CPU time, physical devices, and developer patience. Multiply that by about 50 for apps that run on all phones, not just ones with special NFC hardware...
- Drbble 14y ago
  I know aa certain manufacturer who won't update their Nexus One phone to ICS either..
  - ajross 14y ago
    The Nexus One is two and a half years old at this point, it really can't be looked at as a "developer" phone anymore, even if it will works well for casual usage. And it's stuck with only 512MB of built-in flash to store the image. ICS as shipped on other device simply won't fit. It would have to be a custom spin, which for a device this far removed from the state of the art just isn't worth anyone's time.
    - w0utert 14y ago
      I have a smartphone that is 3.5 years old already, and it's still getting the latest OS updates. It wasn't even sold as a developer phone either. I'll leave it to the reader to guess what phone it is. No matter how you spin it, Android OS updates are one big pile of fail, even if you buy a Nexus device.
      - ajross 14y ago
        The iPhone 3GS is not quite three years old, and is the oldest device supported by iOS 5. Its predecessor is just under 4 years old, and is not. (i.e. your 3GS "got" the latest update, it isn't "getting" new ones and will be obsolete at the next major revision too). So Apple products are better supported by about a year. Actually, you can look at this as an aliasing issue in the data. The 3GS and Nexus One were both the "oldest" supported phones at the release of a major OS version, and that happened about just about exactly 2 years for both of them. One fell on one side of the support decision and one on the other. The "pile of fail" flameage is beneath this site. Stop that, you're polluting our nice community with your garbage. Argue. Don't sling poo.
rogerbinns 14y ago
Don't forget stunts like Tmo updating the HTC Sensation, but removing wifi hotspot at the same time: http://www.tmonews.com/2012/05/confirmed-htc-sensation-4g-ice-cream-sandwich-update-will-end-free-tethering/ http://www.tmonews.com/2012/05/confirmed-htc-sensation-4g-ic... With my G2 it took 12 months from Gingerbread being available to it being on the phone. I'm now using a Nexus but that sadly means no wifi calling.
- ryanhuff 14y ago
  Wow. That is very disappointing. The one reason why I stayed with my T-Mobile service was the free hotspot feature of my htc sensation 4g. I certainly won't be upgrading to its now, and will likely leave T-Mobile when my deal ends. Sure the others charge as well, but my T-Mobile service was already a compromise of poor coverage for me.
  - fpgeek 14y ago
    Yeah, I'm sure there are lots of people who have no idea that their free tethering wasn't intentional (or, if intentional, that intentions had changed). If you want ICS anyway, CM9 and AOKP are coming along reasonably well for the Sensation (including the T-Mobile variant), but that's only a temporary solution, of course.
- tomdtpink 14y ago
  HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))
clarky07 14y ago
Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too. Many of them put their own tweaks on Android which means that they have to do updates on their end to get Android upgrades. It's absurd that I as a developer am forced to release for 2.2 at this point. 95% of my iOS customers are on 5.0 or better, and 88% of them are on 5.1 which came out in March. I think roughly 20% of android is still on 2.2, and most are on 2.3. Seems pretty silly when 4.0 came out 7 months ago.
- jerrya 14y ago
  Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too. I'm sorry for not including that in my comment, you're absolutely right. That's what I get for netflixing dr. who while browsing HN.
- nextparadigms 14y ago
  This is why I think Google should release major versions of Android only once a year, so 4.0 last fall, 5.0 this one, 6.0 fall 2013, and so on, instead of twice per year (with some anomaly in the Honeycomb period, which wasn't open sourced). Manufacturers and carriers would have to upgrade fewer times (and hopefully more devices), and the vast majority of users should only be 1 version behind.
- thought_alarm 14y ago
  > Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too Carriers have absolute control over the consumer sales channels, and that gives them all the power. The carriers demand extreme control over the hardware and software pushed through those sales channels, and the manufacturers (other than Apple) have no choice but to give them that control because that is how you win in this business. Just ask Samsung, who made $5 billion last quarter selling devices running outdated Android 2.x. Or ask HTC, who got crushed by the carriers after offering devices with unlocked Android bootloaders. If you're a manufacturer, you win by being the one who makes the carriers the most money per customer per month. So how does ICS help Samsung make more money for Verizon? How does upgrading old devices to ICS help Samsung make more money for Verizon? If you're Samsung, that's the only question you're trying to answer. The reality is that ICS does not help Samsung or any other manufacturer make more money for Verizon, and that's why ICS adoption has been so low. The problem is that the manufacturers (other than Apple) have little desire to change this business model. If (and when) Samsung begins to defy the carriers, LG and Motorola and HTC will trip over themselves to take Samsung's place and become the next darling of the carriers.
andyjohnson0 14y ago
I have a Galaxy S II on t-mobile and I got the upgrade to ics last month. This may be because I'm in the UK, but I wonder how you're trying to do the upgrade. Are you aware that you have to use the Kies application to install the upgrade?
- jerrya 14y ago
  Yes, it's because you're in the UK. For the most part, US carriers (including AT&T and US Tmo) have not yet released official ICS upgrades. http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/05/14/us-galaxy-s2-4-0-ics-update-still-awaited-as-rollout-goes-on/ http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/05/14/us-galaxy-s2-4-0-ic...

by jerrya 14y ago

jrockway 14y ago

I agree completely. Fragmentation isn't something Google wants; we waste a ton of engineering effort supporting old devices. For example, Google Wallet has to support Gingerbread for at least two years because one carrier won't upgrade their Nexus S to Ice Cream Sandwich. That's one extra test run for every commit for two years, eating up thousands of hours of CPU time, physical devices, and developer patience. Multiply that by about 50 for apps that run on all phones, not just ones with special NFC hardware...

Drbble 14y ago
I know aa certain manufacturer who won't update their Nexus One phone to ICS either..
- ajross 14y ago
  The Nexus One is two and a half years old at this point, it really can't be looked at as a "developer" phone anymore, even if it will works well for casual usage. And it's stuck with only 512MB of built-in flash to store the image. ICS as shipped on other device simply won't fit. It would have to be a custom spin, which for a device this far removed from the state of the art just isn't worth anyone's time.
  - w0utert 14y ago
    I have a smartphone that is 3.5 years old already, and it's still getting the latest OS updates. It wasn't even sold as a developer phone either. I'll leave it to the reader to guess what phone it is. No matter how you spin it, Android OS updates are one big pile of fail, even if you buy a Nexus device.
    - ajross 14y ago
      The iPhone 3GS is not quite three years old, and is the oldest device supported by iOS 5. Its predecessor is just under 4 years old, and is not. (i.e. your 3GS "got" the latest update, it isn't "getting" new ones and will be obsolete at the next major revision too). So Apple products are better supported by about a year. Actually, you can look at this as an aliasing issue in the data. The 3GS and Nexus One were both the "oldest" supported phones at the release of a major OS version, and that happened about just about exactly 2 years for both of them. One fell on one side of the support decision and one on the other. The "pile of fail" flameage is beneath this site. Stop that, you're polluting our nice community with your garbage. Argue. Don't sling poo.

rogerbinns 14y ago

Don't forget stunts like Tmo updating the HTC Sensation, but removing wifi hotspot at the same time: http://www.tmonews.com/2012/05/confirmed-htc-sensation-4g-ice-cream-sandwich-update-will-end-free-tethering/ http://www.tmonews.com/2012/05/confirmed-htc-sensation-4g-ic... With my G2 it took 12 months from Gingerbread being available to it being on the phone. I'm now using a Nexus but that sadly means no wifi calling.

ryanhuff 14y ago
Wow. That is very disappointing. The one reason why I stayed with my T-Mobile service was the free hotspot feature of my htc sensation 4g. I certainly won't be upgrading to its now, and will likely leave T-Mobile when my deal ends. Sure the others charge as well, but my T-Mobile service was already a compromise of poor coverage for me.
- fpgeek 14y ago
  Yeah, I'm sure there are lots of people who have no idea that their free tethering wasn't intentional (or, if intentional, that intentions had changed). If you want ICS anyway, CM9 and AOKP are coming along reasonably well for the Sensation (including the T-Mobile variant), but that's only a temporary solution, of course.
tomdtpink 14y ago
HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))HN censorhips your comments to SUIT THEIR GREEDY GOALS. TROLLS BRINGS OUT YOUR PUUPES :))))

clarky07 14y ago

Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too. Many of them put their own tweaks on Android which means that they have to do updates on their end to get Android upgrades. It's absurd that I as a developer am forced to release for 2.2 at this point. 95% of my iOS customers are on 5.0 or better, and 88% of them are on 5.1 which came out in March. I think roughly 20% of android is still on 2.2, and most are on 2.3. Seems pretty silly when 4.0 came out 7 months ago.

jerrya 14y ago
Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too. I'm sorry for not including that in my comment, you're absolutely right. That's what I get for netflixing dr. who while browsing HN.
nextparadigms 14y ago
This is why I think Google should release major versions of Android only once a year, so 4.0 last fall, 5.0 this one, 6.0 fall 2013, and so on, instead of twice per year (with some anomaly in the Honeycomb period, which wasn't open sourced). Manufacturers and carriers would have to upgrade fewer times (and hopefully more devices), and the vast majority of users should only be 1 version behind.
thought_alarm 14y ago
> Note that it isn't just the carriers that suck, it's the manufacturers too Carriers have absolute control over the consumer sales channels, and that gives them all the power. The carriers demand extreme control over the hardware and software pushed through those sales channels, and the manufacturers (other than Apple) have no choice but to give them that control because that is how you win in this business. Just ask Samsung, who made $5 billion last quarter selling devices running outdated Android 2.x. Or ask HTC, who got crushed by the carriers after offering devices with unlocked Android bootloaders. If you're a manufacturer, you win by being the one who makes the carriers the most money per customer per month. So how does ICS help Samsung make more money for Verizon? How does upgrading old devices to ICS help Samsung make more money for Verizon? If you're Samsung, that's the only question you're trying to answer. The reality is that ICS does not help Samsung or any other manufacturer make more money for Verizon, and that's why ICS adoption has been so low. The problem is that the manufacturers (other than Apple) have little desire to change this business model. If (and when) Samsung begins to defy the carriers, LG and Motorola and HTC will trip over themselves to take Samsung's place and become the next darling of the carriers.

andyjohnson0 14y ago

I have a Galaxy S II on t-mobile and I got the upgrade to ics last month. This may be because I'm in the UK, but I wonder how you're trying to do the upgrade. Are you aware that you have to use the Kies application to install the upgrade?

jerrya 14y ago
Yes, it's because you're in the UK. For the most part, US carriers (including AT&T and US Tmo) have not yet released official ICS upgrades. http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/05/14/us-galaxy-s2-4-0-ics-update-still-awaited-as-rollout-goes-on/ http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/05/14/us-galaxy-s2-4-0-ic...