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53 year old here, almost 40 years experience developing professional software (yes, I was one of those kids) .. all I can tell you the one bit of advice that ha

53 year old here, almost 40 years experience developing professional software (yes, I was one of those kids) .. all I can tell you the one bit of advice that has ALWAYS helped me through this situation, and I've faced it multiple times: Do not stop learning. Ever. Seriously. Just because you graduated with a piece of paper doesn't mean you can stop studying. This is a fatal mistake. Study the things that will make it easier and more effective for you to exchange with others. Your diploma isn't worth a THING until you've actually delivered something - a product or service - to the world, which someone, somewhere is willing to pay for. Until you've actually exchanged something with the world, you are of little use to it. That is a cold hard fact, which you can either resist or embrace. That sense of entitlement you might feel? That is what you need to work on. There is no such thing as a free lunch.

0xedd 3y ago
I don't know. It feels like the digital age will die with the advent of AI. People keep casting doubt. But, that's purely out of a place of ego. When you work with those tools. When you build tools on top of those tools. When you follow the research. When you notice the rate of advancement. Then, it becomes blind faith to think AI is not the twilight of digital work for humans. Effectively no one is debugging assembly. But, I'm supposed to be convinced "someone will need to be there when things break"? Come on. There are millions in the field worldwide. What you say is true, from my own experience as well. That said, it feels like a career change is in order simply to be able to continue to provide 10 years from now (There's another 30+ years I need to work before they let me die).
- boffinAudio 3y ago
  We had those feelings when DOS came along to replace Unix. Then we had that feeling when we had to choose Windows over OS/2. Then we had the same feeling when the Internet came along - it was going to DOOM programming everywhere. Then we had that feeling when AOL dumped its users on the Internet. Then we had that feeling when Google rose, and all the Web 2.0 came along to make everyones' dreams of a free and open Internet dystopian and decrepit. You can't use AI if you can't talk to AI, and you can't talk to AI if you don't understand things the way that AI does. AI is us. Just like the Internet was/is/will always be. In 10 years time when nobody programs any more, what will train the AI? The dog that was put there to stop us touching the computer? ;)
  - binary132 3y ago
    > AI is us In case you hadn’t noticed, “us” is the competition. But the machine “us” can be made arbitrarily faster and cheaper than us, for what is converging on a similar technical skillset.
    - boffinAudio 3y ago
      AI is nothing without us. Sure, it has a big set of training data now - but just how far do you think this will recurse before the knowledge becomes useless? I'm not convinced AI is anything other than just another grep. A fancy one, for sure, but still its only as good as the data you give it. As has been the case with computers since the very beginning. Of course, some AI-pro head will come along and tell me why I'm wrong, but the proof is in the pudding. If nobody is coding any more, how will AI learn how to code? Is AI the ultimate stagnation of technology? It really could be, you know. As it stands right now, I'm seeing junior programmers who cannot get AI to do things, whereas I can get AI to do things better than a junior programmer. But thats only because of my experience and knowledge. AI can be made to function really, really well as a junior dev - but only for as long as there are really good datasets from real human developers out there to work with. If the kids don't keep learning to program, that dataset is going to stagnate...
    - aleph_minus_one 3y ago
      > But the machine “us” can be made arbitrarily faster and cheaper than us, for what is converging on a similar technical skillset. Reading less marketing pitches from these AI companies is good for your sanity. :-D
mancerayder 3y ago
How to find the time? Meeting heavy companies as an engineering manager, after a certain age you want to relax after 7p and weekends and not work on a side project The only ways to learn: 1) quit and study or work on side projects with savings, risking resume gap and forever unemployability as an Old 2) work hard at current role to sneak into useful projects, ignoring management responsibilities and other priorities at current co 3) work at night and weekends on personal projects and research All hideous options if you ask me.

0xedd 3y ago

I don't know. It feels like the digital age will die with the advent of AI. People keep casting doubt. But, that's purely out of a place of ego. When you work with those tools. When you build tools on top of those tools. When you follow the research. When you notice the rate of advancement. Then, it becomes blind faith to think AI is not the twilight of digital work for humans. Effectively no one is debugging assembly. But, I'm supposed to be convinced "someone will need to be there when things break"? Come on. There are millions in the field worldwide. What you say is true, from my own experience as well. That said, it feels like a career change is in order simply to be able to continue to provide 10 years from now (There's another 30+ years I need to work before they let me die).

boffinAudio 3y ago
We had those feelings when DOS came along to replace Unix. Then we had that feeling when we had to choose Windows over OS/2. Then we had the same feeling when the Internet came along - it was going to DOOM programming everywhere. Then we had that feeling when AOL dumped its users on the Internet. Then we had that feeling when Google rose, and all the Web 2.0 came along to make everyones' dreams of a free and open Internet dystopian and decrepit. You can't use AI if you can't talk to AI, and you can't talk to AI if you don't understand things the way that AI does. AI is us. Just like the Internet was/is/will always be. In 10 years time when nobody programs any more, what will train the AI? The dog that was put there to stop us touching the computer? ;)
- binary132 3y ago
  > AI is us In case you hadn’t noticed, “us” is the competition. But the machine “us” can be made arbitrarily faster and cheaper than us, for what is converging on a similar technical skillset.
  - boffinAudio 3y ago
    AI is nothing without us. Sure, it has a big set of training data now - but just how far do you think this will recurse before the knowledge becomes useless? I'm not convinced AI is anything other than just another grep. A fancy one, for sure, but still its only as good as the data you give it. As has been the case with computers since the very beginning. Of course, some AI-pro head will come along and tell me why I'm wrong, but the proof is in the pudding. If nobody is coding any more, how will AI learn how to code? Is AI the ultimate stagnation of technology? It really could be, you know. As it stands right now, I'm seeing junior programmers who cannot get AI to do things, whereas I can get AI to do things better than a junior programmer. But thats only because of my experience and knowledge. AI can be made to function really, really well as a junior dev - but only for as long as there are really good datasets from real human developers out there to work with. If the kids don't keep learning to program, that dataset is going to stagnate...
  - aleph_minus_one 3y ago
    > But the machine “us” can be made arbitrarily faster and cheaper than us, for what is converging on a similar technical skillset. Reading less marketing pitches from these AI companies is good for your sanity. :-D

mancerayder 3y ago

How to find the time? Meeting heavy companies as an engineering manager, after a certain age you want to relax after 7p and weekends and not work on a side project The only ways to learn: 1) quit and study or work on side projects with savings, risking resume gap and forever unemployability as an Old 2) work hard at current role to sneak into useful projects, ignoring management responsibilities and other priorities at current co 3) work at night and weekends on personal projects and research All hideous options if you ask me.