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Great post. I have an awful lot of respect for Zed Shaw and what he's done (and, no, not for "Rails is a Ghetto" but for his directed learning programming books
by cletus 14y ago
Great post. I have an awful lot of respect for Zed Shaw and what he's done (and, no, not for "Rails is a Ghetto" but for his directed learning programming books, which IMHO are probably the best approach for newcomers).
I'm disappointed that Jeff has taken what is essentially an elitist and exclusionary view. Programming is not a zero sum game. Every new programmer isn't a threat to your livelihood and your existence (unless, you know, you suck at your job).
There's a lot of wisdom in the last two paragraphs. Another facet of this is those (typically young) programmers who treat any criticism of their ideas to criticisms of themselves as people (of course this isn't unique to programming).
You need to get over that as it is an impediment to becoming more proficient at your chosen craft. Your work isn't your identity. Don't treat it as such.
- demian 14y agoI don't believe this post gets the real reason why Jeff said what he said. In my opinion, Jeff projected some of his issues with the current state of the software development profession (mainly the "hack fist, ask questions later" aproach). The idea that bothered him wasn't born from elitism, identity, or the fact that people were learning to code, but the idea that, to him, this makes this issue worse. It's true that he is making an implicit leap from "everyone should learn to code" to "everyone should be a programmer". I personally don't agree, but maybie he has a good argument. Maybie he should try to explain that connection a little further.
- yo-mf 14y agoI realize that you meant to say "hack first", but I think hack fist is pretty appropriate as well. Also, it would make a killer heavy metal band name.
- peejaybee 14y ago"Hack fist" is what a "brogrammer" uses to pound out some code.
- saraid216 14y agoExcept that Jeff would still be wrong on this count. If more people were trying to learn how to program, there would be a lot more effort devoted to figuring out how to teach coding better.
- B-Con 14y agoThis is a terrible post. He wildly exaggerates Jeff's statements and completely misses the point of it, which was not in any way "no one should learn to program", but rather "don't learn specialized skill sets you don't need". Jeff's point focused on whether programming was the best path to solving a problem for most people, and whether they would actually gain anything from it. His main argument was that programming was just a tool for problem solving, and it didn't solve problems that most people would need to. Rather than do a half-baked job of writing some code, people should take a different, more effective route. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that's what he said. And this post completely misses the point and makes Jeff's post out to be something it was clearly not meant to be.
- zedshaw 14y agoThe title says "Please don't learn to code". Holy crap, how can so many smart people be so incredibly bad at reading comprehension.
- dbecker 14y agoThe title was meant as an attention grabber, but the text does not suggest that NO ONE should learn to code. The text only disputes that EVERYONE should learn to code.
- gregors 14y agoback up 200 years and replace coding with reading...
- sklipo 14y agoback up 200 years and replace plumbing with reading... Your argument isn't evidence for anything at all. There's a big difference between reading and coding: reading is a very useful method of communication. Everyone should be literate just like everyone should be able to speak. Coding, on the other hand, is much more along the lines of plumbing than language.
- reinhardt 14y agoProgramming is praised as a must-have life skill by... programmers. Comparison of programming with plumbing draws fierce condemnation as elitism. News at 11.
- ahquresh 14y agoI agree with you completely, I do not know much about Zed Shaw, being a fairly new and somewhat young programmer but the post leads me to believe that programming should be a part of our general education along with math and the sciences. One does not have to make a career out of it, but having basic understanding of programming and just the general technologies that dominate our lives today can go a long way in securing a strong future for individuals and society as a whole.
- vadman 14y agoIf the general population programs as much as it applies math and sciences, Atwood's worries about "more bad code" would be completely moot.