3 ms·

the US Needs a 9/11 Commission for Covid

19 points by makaimc 3y ago

sp332 3y ago
Maybe something more credible than the 9/11 Commission.
- hscontinuity 3y ago
  This should remain the only comment except for a non-paywalled archived source.
  - h2odragon 3y ago
    https://archive.ph/xg9V3 https://archive.ph/xg9V3
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
sandworm101 3y ago
[flagged]
h2odragon 3y ago
Remember the fuss over Ventilators. People saying "don't put people with weak pulmonary capillaries on these machines" were "trying to kill everyone" then just ignored. That pattern kept repeating with anyone attempting to point out risks and problems: "we're all in this together, pull your oar" into disaster.
- krisoft 3y ago
  > Remember the fuss over Ventilators. I do. Although they are written with a lower case letter. Just "ventilators". > People saying "don't put people with weak pulmonary capillaries on these machines" were "trying to kill everyone" then just ignored. We have people who specialises in respiratory support. Figuring when to put someone on a ventilator, and what type of ventilation they require and for how long are complex questions. There are many many dangers involved which the doctors working with these procedures are very well aware of. These decisions are best made by the patient/patient's legal healthcare proxy in consultation with the healthcare team. Everyone else can be and should be ignored quite honestly.
  - TMWNN 3y ago
    >We have people who specialises in respiratory support. Figuring when to put someone on a ventilator, and what type of ventilation they require and for how long are complex questions. There are many many dangers involved which the doctors working with these procedures are very well aware of. These decisions are best made by the patient/patient's legal healthcare proxy in consultation with the healthcare team. What kind of "the experts always know what they're doing" pablum is this? h2odragon's point is that those specialists were completely wrong. >Everyone else can be and should be ignored quite honestly. This article from April 2020 <https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-overused-for-covid-19/ https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-...> was completely vindicated in retrospect.
    - krisoft 3y ago
      > What kind of "the experts always know what they're doing" pablum is this? Didn't write anything like that. > This article from April 2020 <https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-... https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-...> was completely vindicated in retrospect. "some critical care physicians" those are the experts I'm talking about. "Sohan Japa, an internal medicine physician at Boston’s Brigham and Women’s Hospital" That's an expert I'm talking about.
- phmqk76 3y ago
  Remember when medicine was unequipped to deal with COVID because it presented as-yet unforeseen challenges in treatment? It was a crazy time, I remember it well. It took months, but practices and procedures caught up. It wasn’t perfect, and I hope that we’ve learned enough that next time we do better. But medical professionals gave every ounce of their beings and sacrificed their safety, and often their lives, to provide medical care for a novel disease. While I’m sure you sat on your ass remote working from home.
082349872349872 3y ago
the world in general (and the US in particular) needs to accept that the pandemic could have been over in months if not weeks if people hadn't taken a softball "man v nature" project and immediately turned it into a "man v man" storyline about themselves. https://xkcd.com/2287/ https://xkcd.com/2287/ > We're not gonna make it, are we? People, I mean. —JC
baja_blast 3y ago
Biggest issue in my eyes was authorities denying that covid was airborne until it was scientifically verified. It should have been treated as such in the beginning until proven otherwise, it's better to be safe than sorry and it should have been obvious by how fast the virus spread that it was not via contact.
- phmqk76 3y ago
  Absolutely yes.
jfengel 3y ago
I can't imagine it doing any good. It will be accused of partisanship, no matter how non-partisan the construction of the panel. And they'll probably be right, given that somebody has to put the panel together, and they'll end up nudging it one way or the other. In all likelihood they'll end up with one member representing a specific view, in the name of fairness, and they'll disagree wildly with the final report. The news will consist of discussions between that guy and one other person, making it look like it's an equal-and-opposite argument. I'm not saying that guy is wrong, or that he's right. I'm saying that I cannot imagine a circumstance in which the result settles anything.

19 points by makaimc 3y ago

sp332 3y ago

Maybe something more credible than the 9/11 Commission.

hscontinuity 3y ago
This should remain the only comment except for a non-paywalled archived source.
- h2odragon 3y ago
  https://archive.ph/xg9V3 https://archive.ph/xg9V3
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

sandworm101 3y ago

[flagged]

h2odragon 3y ago

Remember the fuss over Ventilators. People saying "don't put people with weak pulmonary capillaries on these machines" were "trying to kill everyone" then just ignored. That pattern kept repeating with anyone attempting to point out risks and problems: "we're all in this together, pull your oar" into disaster.

krisoft 3y ago
> Remember the fuss over Ventilators. I do. Although they are written with a lower case letter. Just "ventilators". > People saying "don't put people with weak pulmonary capillaries on these machines" were "trying to kill everyone" then just ignored. We have people who specialises in respiratory support. Figuring when to put someone on a ventilator, and what type of ventilation they require and for how long are complex questions. There are many many dangers involved which the doctors working with these procedures are very well aware of. These decisions are best made by the patient/patient's legal healthcare proxy in consultation with the healthcare team. Everyone else can be and should be ignored quite honestly.
- TMWNN 3y ago
  >We have people who specialises in respiratory support. Figuring when to put someone on a ventilator, and what type of ventilation they require and for how long are complex questions. There are many many dangers involved which the doctors working with these procedures are very well aware of. These decisions are best made by the patient/patient's legal healthcare proxy in consultation with the healthcare team. What kind of "the experts always know what they're doing" pablum is this? h2odragon's point is that those specialists were completely wrong. >Everyone else can be and should be ignored quite honestly. This article from April 2020 <https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-overused-for-covid-19/ https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-...> was completely vindicated in retrospect.
  - krisoft 3y ago
    > What kind of "the experts always know what they're doing" pablum is this? Didn't write anything like that. > This article from April 2020 <https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-... https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/08/doctors-say-ventilators-...> was completely vindicated in retrospect. "some critical care physicians" those are the experts I'm talking about. "Sohan Japa, an internal medicine physician at Boston’s Brigham and Women’s Hospital" That's an expert I'm talking about.
phmqk76 3y ago
Remember when medicine was unequipped to deal with COVID because it presented as-yet unforeseen challenges in treatment? It was a crazy time, I remember it well. It took months, but practices and procedures caught up. It wasn’t perfect, and I hope that we’ve learned enough that next time we do better. But medical professionals gave every ounce of their beings and sacrificed their safety, and often their lives, to provide medical care for a novel disease. While I’m sure you sat on your ass remote working from home.

082349872349872 3y ago

the world in general (and the US in particular) needs to accept that the pandemic could have been over in months if not weeks if people hadn't taken a softball "man v nature" project and immediately turned it into a "man v man" storyline about themselves. https://xkcd.com/2287/ https://xkcd.com/2287/ > We're not gonna make it, are we? People, I mean. —JC

baja_blast 3y ago

Biggest issue in my eyes was authorities denying that covid was airborne until it was scientifically verified. It should have been treated as such in the beginning until proven otherwise, it's better to be safe than sorry and it should have been obvious by how fast the virus spread that it was not via contact.

phmqk76 3y ago
Absolutely yes.

jfengel 3y ago

I can't imagine it doing any good. It will be accused of partisanship, no matter how non-partisan the construction of the panel. And they'll probably be right, given that somebody has to put the panel together, and they'll end up nudging it one way or the other. In all likelihood they'll end up with one member representing a specific view, in the name of fairness, and they'll disagree wildly with the final report. The news will consist of discussions between that guy and one other person, making it look like it's an equal-and-opposite argument. I'm not saying that guy is wrong, or that he's right. I'm saying that I cannot imagine a circumstance in which the result settles anything.