3 ms·

Grants?! Isn't that massively anti-competitive/entrenching a monopoly? I would've expected it to be at least disguised as a tax break or something. ('No tax on

by OJFord 3y ago

Grants?! Isn't that massively anti-competitive/entrenching a monopoly? I would've expected it to be at least disguised as a tax break or something. ('No tax on US-manufactured chips' or whatever.)

rapsey 3y ago
Intel has a monopoly?
- hx8 3y ago
  Due to the licensing agreements Intel and AMD have a duopoly on all modern x86 chips.
  - rapsey 3y ago
    Who cares? You can buy performant arm64 laptops and servers. HPC is GPUs.
    - sofixa 3y ago
      > You can buy performant arm64 laptops and servers From? Apple doesn't count due to the extremely narrow usability of their software and the complexity of using other software on their hardware.
      - rapsey 3y ago
        Moving the goal posts
        junaru 3y ago
        Getting caught spewing bullshit.
      - _ea1k 3y ago
        It sounds like the Surface Pro 10 will be a good example. Early reviews of the Snapdragon X Elite sound promising. It wouldn't take much for others to start making competitive offerings as well.
    - hx8 3y ago
      Not all software is compatible with arm64. Specifically I would be worried about attempting to run Windows applications not compiled for arm64, for which there are many. The compatibility layer Windows ships comes at a significant performance impact.
hx8 3y ago
A strong percentage of Intel's current sales are vendor lockin from the historical "Wintel" age (windows + intel). This is a moat Apple finally crossed after great effort, and Windows has made a few attempts to cross. If chips were sold purely on hardware specs and not software lockin then Intel would have much fewer sales. The US giving grants, tax credits, and cheap loans to Intel only serves to extend the lifespan of a company whose compeitive edge is failing.
- nahnahno 3y ago
  Given that their parts have been, up until the past 5 years, clearly better than AMDs (and any other chip manufacturer), and in the last 5 merely competitive, that’s quite the statement. Nevermind that with Gaudi, they also have the only viable AI accelerator besides Nvidia and AMD.
- EraYaN 3y ago
  These grants are for a completely different side of the business. The fab side, and that side is strategically significant for the US government so it makes sense they put some money in. The rest of the world is doing the exact same as well.
Shrezzing 3y ago
They're getting $5.5bn in tax breaks, and loans for $11bn on generous terms too. Their total support package from the CHIPS money is $25bn. Intel are putting in $75bn, taking the total project to $100bn.
bluSCALE4 3y ago
Absolutely. This is why Intel is basically nationalized and no different than an American Huawei.

by OJFord 3y ago

Grants?! Isn't that massively anti-competitive/entrenching a monopoly? I would've expected it to be at least disguised as a tax break or something. ('No tax on US-manufactured chips' or whatever.)

rapsey 3y ago

Intel has a monopoly?

hx8 3y ago
Due to the licensing agreements Intel and AMD have a duopoly on all modern x86 chips.
- rapsey 3y ago
  Who cares? You can buy performant arm64 laptops and servers. HPC is GPUs.
  - sofixa 3y ago
    > You can buy performant arm64 laptops and servers From? Apple doesn't count due to the extremely narrow usability of their software and the complexity of using other software on their hardware.
    - rapsey 3y ago
      Moving the goal posts
      - junaru 3y ago
        Getting caught spewing bullshit.
    - _ea1k 3y ago
      It sounds like the Surface Pro 10 will be a good example. Early reviews of the Snapdragon X Elite sound promising. It wouldn't take much for others to start making competitive offerings as well.
  - hx8 3y ago
    Not all software is compatible with arm64. Specifically I would be worried about attempting to run Windows applications not compiled for arm64, for which there are many. The compatibility layer Windows ships comes at a significant performance impact.

hx8 3y ago

A strong percentage of Intel's current sales are vendor lockin from the historical "Wintel" age (windows + intel). This is a moat Apple finally crossed after great effort, and Windows has made a few attempts to cross. If chips were sold purely on hardware specs and not software lockin then Intel would have much fewer sales. The US giving grants, tax credits, and cheap loans to Intel only serves to extend the lifespan of a company whose compeitive edge is failing.

nahnahno 3y ago
Given that their parts have been, up until the past 5 years, clearly better than AMDs (and any other chip manufacturer), and in the last 5 merely competitive, that’s quite the statement. Nevermind that with Gaudi, they also have the only viable AI accelerator besides Nvidia and AMD.
EraYaN 3y ago
These grants are for a completely different side of the business. The fab side, and that side is strategically significant for the US government so it makes sense they put some money in. The rest of the world is doing the exact same as well.

Shrezzing 3y ago

They're getting $5.5bn in tax breaks, and loans for $11bn on generous terms too. Their total support package from the CHIPS money is $25bn. Intel are putting in $75bn, taking the total project to $100bn.

bluSCALE4 3y ago

Absolutely. This is why Intel is basically nationalized and no different than an American Huawei.