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This comment is being undeservedly downvoted. In-office work has always been an important way to bootstrap your social graph, as are other in-person group acti

This comment is being undeservedly downvoted. In-office work has always been an important way to bootstrap your social graph, as are other in-person group activities such as schooling and college. Of course, some people may not like the commute and prefer in-person work, but any choice has tradeoffs, and the tradeoff in this case is that you usually end up knowing very few people other than your spouse and children which leads to loneliness in mid-life. Relying on school and college friends doesn’t work as they would have also moved on due to other responsibilities and relocated elsewhere, and due to the lack of shared context that is required to rejuvenate said friendships.

anon291 3y ago
Yeah I figured it would. WFH makes sense for established workers. For those new graduates... It's toxic and a huge set back. I was a hiring manager during COVID... We just stopped hiring new grads. How would we on board them? How would I provide the guidance they needed? Even if my new hires would be in another office, I'd still be able to get someone there to help them in person. Remote? Good luck. Established engineers have enough issues with that.
- em-bee 3y ago
  i am in that exact situation right now. i am trying to hire locals in a somewhat remote work location. most candidates want to work remote. even for a senior it took us a few hours of working face to face before i felt comfortable letting them work remotely. for a junior i can't imagine remote work until they are fully onboarded and able to work independently which may take a few weeks to a few months of time.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  I think the downvotes are purely from the snipe at COVID restrictions, since it is sadly still a hot button topic. My initial urge was to downvote but I undid it and will keep my input neutral there because it’s just not on topic. I personally think that the sudden need to accept remote work, delivery services, and isolating at home opened up a mode of living that until now has been inaccessible to those of us who actually like that sort of thing. Before, socializing with strangers simply couldn’t be avoided, because there was no other realistic way to live, besides going off into the wilderness and setting the entirety of civilization aside. We now have more options and that’s great! People who like the old way can still commute into the office, go to their pub, dine out in person, and so on, but now, the option has opened up for people who don’t want to do that, and I don’t think there is anything wrong with that. One size doesn’t fit all. I now have the option to stay in my house for a month+ and not see another human being if I want, and still earn a living, enjoy modern life, conveniences, shopping, dining… not really possible as recently as 2019. It’s not for everyone but to me it’s better than the old way.
  - anon291 3y ago
    > who actually like that sort of thing. The idea of living in a society (a democracy, even!) in which most people kind of dislike their neighbor is horrifying.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
Nursie 3y ago
There are other ways to do this. I would much rather spend the commute time engaging in local social activities where I live than being forced into a car or public transport for multiple hours a week, just to spend 40 hours in a grey box which is a worse working environment than the one I have at home. This way you can build stronger local ties, rather than remote ties which are likely to evaporate next time you move job, or even department.
Nursie 3y ago
FYI the downvotes are most likely in reaction to the assertion that COVID lockdowns were a huge mistake. Whether they have damaged the fabric of society (and I would certainly dispute that), the idea that they were a mistake in totality is at the very least somewhat contentious.

anon291 3y ago

Yeah I figured it would. WFH makes sense for established workers. For those new graduates... It's toxic and a huge set back. I was a hiring manager during COVID... We just stopped hiring new grads. How would we on board them? How would I provide the guidance they needed? Even if my new hires would be in another office, I'd still be able to get someone there to help them in person. Remote? Good luck. Established engineers have enough issues with that.

em-bee 3y ago
i am in that exact situation right now. i am trying to hire locals in a somewhat remote work location. most candidates want to work remote. even for a senior it took us a few hours of working face to face before i felt comfortable letting them work remotely. for a junior i can't imagine remote work until they are fully onboarded and able to work independently which may take a few weeks to a few months of time.
ryandrake 3y ago
I think the downvotes are purely from the snipe at COVID restrictions, since it is sadly still a hot button topic. My initial urge was to downvote but I undid it and will keep my input neutral there because it’s just not on topic. I personally think that the sudden need to accept remote work, delivery services, and isolating at home opened up a mode of living that until now has been inaccessible to those of us who actually like that sort of thing. Before, socializing with strangers simply couldn’t be avoided, because there was no other realistic way to live, besides going off into the wilderness and setting the entirety of civilization aside. We now have more options and that’s great! People who like the old way can still commute into the office, go to their pub, dine out in person, and so on, but now, the option has opened up for people who don’t want to do that, and I don’t think there is anything wrong with that. One size doesn’t fit all. I now have the option to stay in my house for a month+ and not see another human being if I want, and still earn a living, enjoy modern life, conveniences, shopping, dining… not really possible as recently as 2019. It’s not for everyone but to me it’s better than the old way.
- anon291 3y ago
  > who actually like that sort of thing. The idea of living in a society (a democracy, even!) in which most people kind of dislike their neighbor is horrifying.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]

Nursie 3y ago

There are other ways to do this. I would much rather spend the commute time engaging in local social activities where I live than being forced into a car or public transport for multiple hours a week, just to spend 40 hours in a grey box which is a worse working environment than the one I have at home. This way you can build stronger local ties, rather than remote ties which are likely to evaporate next time you move job, or even department.

Nursie 3y ago

FYI the downvotes are most likely in reaction to the assertion that COVID lockdowns were a huge mistake. Whether they have damaged the fabric of society (and I would certainly dispute that), the idea that they were a mistake in totality is at the very least somewhat contentious.