4 ms·

Also, I thrived and had to deal with way less low level racism. I've heard also less sexism from women who work remote. Being a voice is a better experience for

Also, I thrived and had to deal with way less low level racism. I've heard also less sexism from women who work remote. Being a voice is a better experience for me and levels the playing field.

helboi4 3y ago
I'm a mixed race (black), nonbinary butch lesbian. I definitely have had a workplace where people made cruel gay and trans jokes constantly and my boss was 100% sexist. That's not exactly my ideal workplace either and I did end up working from home as much as I could for that one. But I find it really problematic that you think it's better for minorities to just isolate themselves to protect themselves from these inevitable facts of life. Maybe if it was just racism that I was facing, and I knew through work from home I could spend more time around my black community, I would feel like you do. But as a queer person, I have little to no black community, I do not have close family connections. I do not have some strong childhood friendship group because they bullied me for being queer. My university experience was better but fucking destroyed by covid. Most people I knew left the country in 2020 and never came back. I find finding people who understand me near impossible, and so to keep my sanity, I need to just see human beings, just by default, passively at least. Often, as a queer person, I feel my sense of isolation is only fully allieved by romantic relationships. When my gf broke up with me, I lost my will to live for a few weeks. So I went to the office every single day. I got out of my space, I spoke to some of the nice people there. I went to the pub after work and made some connections with colleagues around my age that helped me. If I was still at my previous more remote job, I think I would've stayed in bed, smoked weed until I was bordering on psychosis and lost my job. I don't know what you want from me. Please drop your image that the only people that benefit from the office are tyrannical old white male middle managers.
- pnutjam 3y ago
  I'm a middle aged Hispanic guy who lives in a very conservative state and works in tech. I have established my own community of friends and family. Work doesn't provide anything for me except a paycheck. I'm friendly at work and I keep in touch and consider some people I've worked with friends, but the majority of people I work with are just work acquaintances. I remember being lonelier in my 20's, but I never really socialized at work. I socialized outside work with my family, or found places I enjoyed being with people I enjoyed being around. "The office" is an antiquated system that's unnecessary. America definitely needs more public spaces, but building your relationships around work is a recipe for disaster. It takes time to build a community, but it's worth it. I don't want to be around people who are forced to be around me, pretend the don't look down on me, sabotage me behind my back. Remote work makes those people forget to discriminate in my experience, I can stand on my merits without that guy who does my job (but sucks) joking about how they could replace me with a sombrero. (actual IRL interaction.) EDIT: spelling
  - helboi4 3y ago
    I feel sorry for you that you live in the US. I don't. I've heard from colleagues from my (lovely) office that when they go to the US office the work culture feels so toxic. Sounds bad, mate. I think you proved my point that WFH benefits older people and people with strong family units. I don't have any of this tying me down or supporting me, and if I lived in a hostile conservative area I would move because why would I want to be miserable about my surroundings. I'm not sure what part of 'I don't have strong family or friendship units' that you don't understand. If you hadn't had a strong family behind you on your 20s, maybe you'd understand me too. I don't feel like people at work look down on me, again, when I was in a job like that, I left. It's as simple as that. I want a workplace where I actually like the people and people are sociable. It's a priority. This weekend once again I had a terrible experience. I was distraught all weekend by my own. Today, I got properly washed and dressed, got out of my house and into the office, had some nice conversations, talked it through with a colleague who i'm actually close to during a smoke break, she gave me a hug, I ate the healthy subsidised food, bought some sleep supplements during lunch break, and it all helped me. Otherwise, I'd still be rolling around crying in my flat. What do you not get that just having SOMEWHERE to go during regular days is important to some of us. I honestly don't understand people that function without obligations like this.
    - pnutjam 3y ago
      I understand, but I've had the reverse experience where having somewhere to go meant I was shut out of the things my friends were doing and I was stuck masking all day. I felt like an automaton who barely spoke. I urge you to find a community outside of work. Work to live, don't live to work.
      - helboi4 3y ago
        Thanks. I definitely don't live to work. As I said, definitely not a type-A, workaholic who loves office surveillance. I barely care about work at all. But I do have to spend most of my life doing it. And what it provides to me is routine and security. The routine part is almost more important to me than the financial security, just because of how my brain works. As I said, without the imperative to be somewhere during (most, preferably not all) regular days, I find it hard to hold it together, especially when I still have to motivate myself to do something as pointless as work for a corporation. So yeah, I don't live to work. I couldn't care less. But I find it hard to find community at all. I try. I fail. The certainty that there is at least the people in the office keeps me going. I will continue to try.

Also, I thrived and had to deal with way less low level racism. I've heard also less sexism from women who work remote. Being a voice is a better experience for me and levels the playing field.

helboi4 3y ago

I'm a mixed race (black), nonbinary butch lesbian. I definitely have had a workplace where people made cruel gay and trans jokes constantly and my boss was 100% sexist. That's not exactly my ideal workplace either and I did end up working from home as much as I could for that one. But I find it really problematic that you think it's better for minorities to just isolate themselves to protect themselves from these inevitable facts of life. Maybe if it was just racism that I was facing, and I knew through work from home I could spend more time around my black community, I would feel like you do. But as a queer person, I have little to no black community, I do not have close family connections. I do not have some strong childhood friendship group because they bullied me for being queer. My university experience was better but fucking destroyed by covid. Most people I knew left the country in 2020 and never came back. I find finding people who understand me near impossible, and so to keep my sanity, I need to just see human beings, just by default, passively at least. Often, as a queer person, I feel my sense of isolation is only fully allieved by romantic relationships. When my gf broke up with me, I lost my will to live for a few weeks. So I went to the office every single day. I got out of my space, I spoke to some of the nice people there. I went to the pub after work and made some connections with colleagues around my age that helped me. If I was still at my previous more remote job, I think I would've stayed in bed, smoked weed until I was bordering on psychosis and lost my job. I don't know what you want from me. Please drop your image that the only people that benefit from the office are tyrannical old white male middle managers.

pnutjam 3y ago
I'm a middle aged Hispanic guy who lives in a very conservative state and works in tech. I have established my own community of friends and family. Work doesn't provide anything for me except a paycheck. I'm friendly at work and I keep in touch and consider some people I've worked with friends, but the majority of people I work with are just work acquaintances. I remember being lonelier in my 20's, but I never really socialized at work. I socialized outside work with my family, or found places I enjoyed being with people I enjoyed being around. "The office" is an antiquated system that's unnecessary. America definitely needs more public spaces, but building your relationships around work is a recipe for disaster. It takes time to build a community, but it's worth it. I don't want to be around people who are forced to be around me, pretend the don't look down on me, sabotage me behind my back. Remote work makes those people forget to discriminate in my experience, I can stand on my merits without that guy who does my job (but sucks) joking about how they could replace me with a sombrero. (actual IRL interaction.) EDIT: spelling
- helboi4 3y ago
  I feel sorry for you that you live in the US. I don't. I've heard from colleagues from my (lovely) office that when they go to the US office the work culture feels so toxic. Sounds bad, mate. I think you proved my point that WFH benefits older people and people with strong family units. I don't have any of this tying me down or supporting me, and if I lived in a hostile conservative area I would move because why would I want to be miserable about my surroundings. I'm not sure what part of 'I don't have strong family or friendship units' that you don't understand. If you hadn't had a strong family behind you on your 20s, maybe you'd understand me too. I don't feel like people at work look down on me, again, when I was in a job like that, I left. It's as simple as that. I want a workplace where I actually like the people and people are sociable. It's a priority. This weekend once again I had a terrible experience. I was distraught all weekend by my own. Today, I got properly washed and dressed, got out of my house and into the office, had some nice conversations, talked it through with a colleague who i'm actually close to during a smoke break, she gave me a hug, I ate the healthy subsidised food, bought some sleep supplements during lunch break, and it all helped me. Otherwise, I'd still be rolling around crying in my flat. What do you not get that just having SOMEWHERE to go during regular days is important to some of us. I honestly don't understand people that function without obligations like this.
  - pnutjam 3y ago
    I understand, but I've had the reverse experience where having somewhere to go meant I was shut out of the things my friends were doing and I was stuck masking all day. I felt like an automaton who barely spoke. I urge you to find a community outside of work. Work to live, don't live to work.
    - helboi4 3y ago
      Thanks. I definitely don't live to work. As I said, definitely not a type-A, workaholic who loves office surveillance. I barely care about work at all. But I do have to spend most of my life doing it. And what it provides to me is routine and security. The routine part is almost more important to me than the financial security, just because of how my brain works. As I said, without the imperative to be somewhere during (most, preferably not all) regular days, I find it hard to hold it together, especially when I still have to motivate myself to do something as pointless as work for a corporation. So yeah, I don't live to work. I couldn't care less. But I find it hard to find community at all. I try. I fail. The certainty that there is at least the people in the office keeps me going. I will continue to try.