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That retro Youtuber gripe is silly. You really think it's worth getting bent out of shape that one guy is using a little bit of lead solder to repair a valuable

That retro Youtuber gripe is silly. You really think it's worth getting bent out of shape that one guy is using a little bit of lead solder to repair a valuable antique thing full of lead solder and thus keep it out of the landfill? They want to use it for technical reasons. There are many more significant sources of lead than oddball hobbyists, such as aviation fuel. Technically most hazardous chemicals we ever use end up in the environment. Even medication. So getting too fixated on a rare specialist use of lead is misguided. We should reduce the uses of lead and other toxic materials where possible, but sometimes it isn't possible or economical.

doubloon 3y ago
The tiny amount of lead they use is inversly proportional to their social influence, they are literally called influencers, and they are influencing an entire generation to be indifferent to use of lead in electronics because the personal risk is easily mitiigated. None if them discuss the social or environmental risk , as if these disasters like Pitcher didnt happen or dont matter
Brian_K_White 3y ago
"You really think it's worth getting bent out of shape that one guy is using a little bit of lead solder to repair a valuable antique" Yes. Not even close. As someone who repaires such things myself, I know that there is no excuse for it. Simple as that. I do it myself and so I know just how not-a-problem it is. Several lead-free solders are perfectly usable in all the same places, and the only way to reduce the background radiation of lead permeating the entire environment, is to stop putting it into the environment. Keeping the antique radio out of the dump does not excuse the fact that the same user had to buy a spool of lead solder which had to be manufactured, and at least half of that spool will go right into the environment, not into museum exhibits. It will be in spatters and sponges and wicks and soldapults and brillo scrubbers and random junk scrapped wiring and junk projects that are not antique radios housed in museums forever. Probably 90% or more of that spool ends up all over the environment rather than in some precious artifact. Yes the lead-free solders are slightly more difficult to work with, but hardly enough to matter. If you never soldered anything before, the very act of soldering successfully at all is a baffling art to a lot of people. After some amount of trial & error, maybe training if they're lucky enough to know someone, they eventually develop a feel and a sense for how to get it to work right. Going from lead to lead-free requires a similar adjustment, but it's a freaking microscopic fraction of the difficulty. Complaining about lead-free solder is nothing but pathetic baby crying, and crying over something that is simply not that difficult, and something that comes at a simply inexcusable cost.
- wakawaka28 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - mordechai9000 3y ago
    I don't think we should be resorting to calling each other crying babies over this. I recognize that you were not the first. > I think nobody craves lead in their life. Plenty of people scoff at the idea that handling lead is risky, whether it's fishing weights, ammunition, or lead solder. I've watched a trained engineer use his teeth to crimp lead fishing weights. He said there wasn't enough exposure to matter, and people had been doing this since before he was born. Is he right? I dunno. I personally want every brain cell I can muster.
    - wakawaka28 3y ago
      Yes, I just said it was petty to single out hobbyists who use a few grams of lead for a good purpose as if they are killing the planet. That is a hysterical take, and he got more hysterical when I called him out on exaggerating, not knowing what he was talking about, and most likely being a hypocrite. The lithium battery in each of our phones is probably more polluting than an average hobbyist's lifetime allotment of solder. >Plenty of people scoff at the idea that handling lead is risky, whether it's fishing weights, ammunition, or lead solder. I've watched a trained engineer use his teeth to crimp lead fishing weights. He said there wasn't enough exposure to matter, and people had been doing this since before he was born. Is he right? I dunno. I personally want every brain cell I can muster. Everything has costs and benefits. In many applications, there are no suitable alternatives to lead, or else the alternatives are scarce and expensive. As a society we have eliminated most excess lead so I think further browbeating over it is silly. Virtually every car has a lead battery, most brass has some lead in it, but otherwise it is scarce in most households. Ammunition is one case where lead is potentially dangerous, but if you need ammunition then the mild precautions necessary to handle the lead are well worth it.
- bxparks 3y ago
  You have strong opinions on the use of leaded solder. I'm curious if you have some numbers to drive home your point. For example, what is the relative risk of using leaded solder for a hobbyist creating a handful of prototype circuit boards a year (using proper ventilation of course), versus living close to an airport exposed to burning jet fuel which contains lead to this day? I want to know, roughly speaking, if using leaded solder a few times a year cause 100X more exposure or only 1/100 the exposure compared to living near an airport. If it's only 1/100 compare to an airport, I'm not going to worry about it. If it's 100X, then I think your position is quite valid. [Addendum: Another example, what is the risk of leaded solder compared to lead exposure from common household items like brass knobs, handles, fixtures, and keys?] My current inventory of solder was obtained from estate sales, so they are all leaded, but old stock, not newly manufactured. If I had not bought them, they would have been thrown away into the garbage dumps.
kortilla 3y ago
Av gas is what has led, not jet fuel. Av gas consumption is negligible by comparison so it’s not the impact you think.
- wakawaka28 3y ago
  Literally tons of aviation fuel vs. trace amounts of fresh lead solder. I think the fuel is obviously worse. Neither one may be so bad that it needs to draw excess concern of course.
  - kortilla 3y ago
    Stop saying “aviation fuel” when you specifically mean the thing with lead. Aviation fuel is a generic category that captures jet fuel and other lead free variants. It makes it sound like you don’t know what you’re talking about because you’re making an incorrect statement about a general category.

doubloon 3y ago

The tiny amount of lead they use is inversly proportional to their social influence, they are literally called influencers, and they are influencing an entire generation to be indifferent to use of lead in electronics because the personal risk is easily mitiigated. None if them discuss the social or environmental risk , as if these disasters like Pitcher didnt happen or dont matter

Brian_K_White 3y ago

"You really think it's worth getting bent out of shape that one guy is using a little bit of lead solder to repair a valuable antique" Yes. Not even close. As someone who repaires such things myself, I know that there is no excuse for it. Simple as that. I do it myself and so I know just how not-a-problem it is. Several lead-free solders are perfectly usable in all the same places, and the only way to reduce the background radiation of lead permeating the entire environment, is to stop putting it into the environment. Keeping the antique radio out of the dump does not excuse the fact that the same user had to buy a spool of lead solder which had to be manufactured, and at least half of that spool will go right into the environment, not into museum exhibits. It will be in spatters and sponges and wicks and soldapults and brillo scrubbers and random junk scrapped wiring and junk projects that are not antique radios housed in museums forever. Probably 90% or more of that spool ends up all over the environment rather than in some precious artifact. Yes the lead-free solders are slightly more difficult to work with, but hardly enough to matter. If you never soldered anything before, the very act of soldering successfully at all is a baffling art to a lot of people. After some amount of trial & error, maybe training if they're lucky enough to know someone, they eventually develop a feel and a sense for how to get it to work right. Going from lead to lead-free requires a similar adjustment, but it's a freaking microscopic fraction of the difficulty. Complaining about lead-free solder is nothing but pathetic baby crying, and crying over something that is simply not that difficult, and something that comes at a simply inexcusable cost.

wakawaka28 3y ago
[flagged]
- mordechai9000 3y ago
  I don't think we should be resorting to calling each other crying babies over this. I recognize that you were not the first. > I think nobody craves lead in their life. Plenty of people scoff at the idea that handling lead is risky, whether it's fishing weights, ammunition, or lead solder. I've watched a trained engineer use his teeth to crimp lead fishing weights. He said there wasn't enough exposure to matter, and people had been doing this since before he was born. Is he right? I dunno. I personally want every brain cell I can muster.
  - wakawaka28 3y ago
    Yes, I just said it was petty to single out hobbyists who use a few grams of lead for a good purpose as if they are killing the planet. That is a hysterical take, and he got more hysterical when I called him out on exaggerating, not knowing what he was talking about, and most likely being a hypocrite. The lithium battery in each of our phones is probably more polluting than an average hobbyist's lifetime allotment of solder. >Plenty of people scoff at the idea that handling lead is risky, whether it's fishing weights, ammunition, or lead solder. I've watched a trained engineer use his teeth to crimp lead fishing weights. He said there wasn't enough exposure to matter, and people had been doing this since before he was born. Is he right? I dunno. I personally want every brain cell I can muster. Everything has costs and benefits. In many applications, there are no suitable alternatives to lead, or else the alternatives are scarce and expensive. As a society we have eliminated most excess lead so I think further browbeating over it is silly. Virtually every car has a lead battery, most brass has some lead in it, but otherwise it is scarce in most households. Ammunition is one case where lead is potentially dangerous, but if you need ammunition then the mild precautions necessary to handle the lead are well worth it.
bxparks 3y ago
You have strong opinions on the use of leaded solder. I'm curious if you have some numbers to drive home your point. For example, what is the relative risk of using leaded solder for a hobbyist creating a handful of prototype circuit boards a year (using proper ventilation of course), versus living close to an airport exposed to burning jet fuel which contains lead to this day? I want to know, roughly speaking, if using leaded solder a few times a year cause 100X more exposure or only 1/100 the exposure compared to living near an airport. If it's only 1/100 compare to an airport, I'm not going to worry about it. If it's 100X, then I think your position is quite valid. [Addendum: Another example, what is the risk of leaded solder compared to lead exposure from common household items like brass knobs, handles, fixtures, and keys?] My current inventory of solder was obtained from estate sales, so they are all leaded, but old stock, not newly manufactured. If I had not bought them, they would have been thrown away into the garbage dumps.

kortilla 3y ago

Av gas is what has led, not jet fuel. Av gas consumption is negligible by comparison so it’s not the impact you think.

wakawaka28 3y ago
Literally tons of aviation fuel vs. trace amounts of fresh lead solder. I think the fuel is obviously worse. Neither one may be so bad that it needs to draw excess concern of course.
- kortilla 3y ago
  Stop saying “aviation fuel” when you specifically mean the thing with lead. Aviation fuel is a generic category that captures jet fuel and other lead free variants. It makes it sound like you don’t know what you’re talking about because you’re making an incorrect statement about a general category.