5 ms·

I don't think "The real Miss Julie" is a clickbaity title. It's a perplexing title if you haven't heard of Strindberg's play, for sure, but that's no different

by gjm11 3y ago

I don't think "The real Miss Julie" is a clickbaity title. It's a perplexing title if you haven't heard of Strindberg's play, for sure, but that's no different from a title like "Improving Kubernetes" or "Riemann Hypothesis proved", which will make sense only if you know about Kubernetes or the Riemann Hypothesis. If you _have_ heard of Strindberg's play and make the connection with the title, then the obvious interpretation is something like "it turns out that there was an actual person Strindberg's character was based on, and this article is about her". Which, as it happens, is exactly correct. I think it's worth distinguishing between "I can't tell what this is about from the title, because it's clickbait" and "I can't tell what this is about from the title, because I happen not to be familiar with the subject matter". This is the second of those, not the first. (For the avoidance of doubt, I am not in the least suggesting that there's anything wrong with happening not to be familiar with the subject matter.)

CyberDildonics 3y ago
hat's no different from a title like "Improving Kubernetes" or "Riemann Hypothesis proved" It's completely different because there is no context, so it could be about anything, especially on a general technology 'news' site. "Riemann Hypothesis" is going not ambiguous and neither is anything with "Kubernetes" in the name. A generic sentence with a generic first name is. I think this is obvious to most people.
- quesera 3y ago
  HN is not a technology site. Not exclusively, anyway. Some days not even primarily! HN is an aggregator, so we pluck articles from varied contexts all the time. "Intellectual curiosity". But "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes". In all cases, a web search will return, as the first result, the correct reference. If we took a random sampling of people off the street, I'd be curious to see how many would recognize Miss Julie vs the other two. I lean toward more for Miss Julie! Anyway, what's a better title? "The Real Miss Julie (being a character in an eponymous 1888 play by Swedish playwright August Strindberg)"?
  - CyberDildonics 3y ago
    "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes" No it doesn't. Let's think super hard. "Miss Julie" could be anyone named Julie. What else would "Riemann Hypothesis" or "Kubernetes" mean? If we took a random sampling of people off the street, This isn't 'the street', it's a tech website. Anyway, what's a better title? "The Real Miss Julie (being a character in an eponymous 1888 play by Swedish playwright August Strindberg)"? Yeah, that's much better, there is actual information and context.
    - CRConrad 3y ago
      > > "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes" > No it doesn't. Let's think super hard. "Miss Julie" could be anyone named Julie. That is, frankly, bullshit. "Let's think super hard"... "Romeo and Juliet" could be any two people named Romeo and Juliet. But that's not what you thought when you saw the names, is it? Just because your Allgemeingbildung is sucky enough to only know (or at least have vaguely heard of) Shakespeare, but not Strindberg, doesn't make "Miss Julie" any more generic than "Romeo and Juliet". It just means you need to work on widening your literary horizons, not just your hacker ones.
    - pvg 3y ago
      Your interpretation of HN's title conventions is inaccurate, titles are not required to have 'context' and that alone does not make them clickbait. That's never been a thing - it might not be to your taste but your 'pipeline' is just plum wrong, e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query=by%3Adang%20%22work%20a%20little%22&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...
    - quesera 3y ago
      Bad examples. Anyone named Riemann might hypothesize on any subject. And Kubernetes is a word in Ancient Greek. I had a Natural History professor in college named Riemann. He was a Darwinist, the irony! And I've met Greek scholars in the same venue. At some point, you just have to say "My liberal arts education was cut short before we got to 19th C Scandinavian playwrights". It's fine. You're in excellent company. (At the risk of offending the canon, I have to say that I really did not enjoy Strindberg, and although I acknowledge the cultural significance, I would happily exchange those hours for one kanelbulle.)

by gjm11 3y ago

CyberDildonics 3y ago

hat's no different from a title like "Improving Kubernetes" or "Riemann Hypothesis proved" It's completely different because there is no context, so it could be about anything, especially on a general technology 'news' site. "Riemann Hypothesis" is going not ambiguous and neither is anything with "Kubernetes" in the name. A generic sentence with a generic first name is. I think this is obvious to most people.

quesera 3y ago
HN is not a technology site. Not exclusively, anyway. Some days not even primarily! HN is an aggregator, so we pluck articles from varied contexts all the time. "Intellectual curiosity". But "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes". In all cases, a web search will return, as the first result, the correct reference. If we took a random sampling of people off the street, I'd be curious to see how many would recognize Miss Julie vs the other two. I lean toward more for Miss Julie! Anyway, what's a better title? "The Real Miss Julie (being a character in an eponymous 1888 play by Swedish playwright August Strindberg)"?
- CyberDildonics 3y ago
  "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes" No it doesn't. Let's think super hard. "Miss Julie" could be anyone named Julie. What else would "Riemann Hypothesis" or "Kubernetes" mean? If we took a random sampling of people off the street, This isn't 'the street', it's a tech website. Anyway, what's a better title? "The Real Miss Julie (being a character in an eponymous 1888 play by Swedish playwright August Strindberg)"? Yeah, that's much better, there is actual information and context.
  - CRConrad 3y ago
    > > "Miss Julie" has exactly as much inherent context as "Riemann Hypothesis", or "Kubernetes" > No it doesn't. Let's think super hard. "Miss Julie" could be anyone named Julie. That is, frankly, bullshit. "Let's think super hard"... "Romeo and Juliet" could be any two people named Romeo and Juliet. But that's not what you thought when you saw the names, is it? Just because your Allgemeingbildung is sucky enough to only know (or at least have vaguely heard of) Shakespeare, but not Strindberg, doesn't make "Miss Julie" any more generic than "Romeo and Juliet". It just means you need to work on widening your literary horizons, not just your hacker ones.
  - pvg 3y ago
    Your interpretation of HN's title conventions is inaccurate, titles are not required to have 'context' and that alone does not make them clickbait. That's never been a thing - it might not be to your taste but your 'pipeline' is just plum wrong, e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query=by%3Adang%20%22work%20a%20little%22&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...
  - quesera 3y ago
    Bad examples. Anyone named Riemann might hypothesize on any subject. And Kubernetes is a word in Ancient Greek. I had a Natural History professor in college named Riemann. He was a Darwinist, the irony! And I've met Greek scholars in the same venue. At some point, you just have to say "My liberal arts education was cut short before we got to 19th C Scandinavian playwrights". It's fine. You're in excellent company. (At the risk of offending the canon, I have to say that I really did not enjoy Strindberg, and although I acknowledge the cultural significance, I would happily exchange those hours for one kanelbulle.)