7 ms·

I just read on a local Reddit thread that the lines at Burger King and KFC were insane. So, not really I’m afraid!

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
I gave up on these garbage fast-food chains after the 2022 inflation skyrocket. A decent burger at McDs or BK in Europe today is now about 9 Euros, closer to gourmet burger prices at fancy local burger joints with red brick walls where the waiters have lumberjack shirts, beards and man-buns. But 9 Euros for McDs/BK is taking the mickey considering it's just some sorry-ass excuse for a burger, thrown together in a pinch from the cheapest possible ingredients, into a paper bag, in a loud, crowded, dirty joint, employing lowly paid migrants from the job center. It was convenient in the days when it was still cheap, but now it's just overpriced slop. If I want cheap fast food I get a Döner Kebab for 4 Euros, and this way I'm also supporting a local business not the fat margins of off-shore shareholders.
- rwmj 3y ago
  I don't get it anyway, burgers are about the simplest food to make yourself.
  - janfoeh 3y ago
    _A_ burger? Sure. _The_ burger? Not by a long shot. I've been trying off and on for a year to recreate my platonic ideal of a burger, the (German) McD Quarterpounder with cheese of yore before they switched to their "made to order" system. I've yet to nail either the patty or the bun. Recreating something specific at home is non-trivial.
    - OJFord 3y ago
      But fortunately it's trivial to do better than that specific.
      - janfoeh 3y ago
        No, it isn't, which was my point entirely. Besides — are you American? If you are, you are unlikely to know what my _that_ even is. I have eaten at McDonalds in the US, and it's not an experience I would care to repeat. So if that's true, I can kinda see where you are coming from, but still - different strokes and all that jazz?
        OJFord 3y ago
        I thought your point was about exact reproduction? I was being slightly snidely critical of fast food burgers in general, saying it's easy to make better. (If you really want exact, the only helpful things I can think of which I almost said are to add more/introduce sugar to the bun - yet somehow keep it more like a washing-up sponge than brioche - and cook the burger from frozen, it'll change the texture.) No, I'm British, I don't know how British McDonalds burgers compare to German ones, but it's probably almost 20y since I've had one anyway. I did have one in the Netherlands ..10y ago (though gosh, that visit feels much more recent!) which was certainly different to here, but y'know, it's still fast food.
        janfoeh 3y ago
        Adding more sugar to the buns is an interesting idea, thanks. I will give that a shot for my next batch. The texture of the patty is one of the things I have nailed; that was just a matter of adding salt into the mince instead of seasoning from the outside - that makes them a little denser, more meatloaf-like, like freezing would. And yeah, the regional differences are interesting. I had my last one in the Netherlands.. 21 years ago, and they still served them in styrofoam containers, many years after they had been phased out in Germany. And in Denmark, you could draft your own condiments into little waffle cones. Cute.
    - nebula8804 3y ago
      Fascinating! The made to order system has them cook the patty "fresh" as shown here: [1]: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IVRlYugm69Y https://youtube.com/watch?v=IVRlYugm69Y Just to be clear, are you trying to mimic the burger as it was made before this new system was introduced? Because that was just a frozen puck...
      - janfoeh 3y ago
        Right! I'm talking about the "batch-made burgers resting in a warming cabinet until sold" process. That resting process gives them some time to meld together, I presume. To me, a good burger is a messy, fused together thing that looks as if someone has taken a nap on them. With made-to-order, McDonalds not only lost the "fast" in "fast food", but the result is just some stack of components that is so lukewarm, half of the time the cheese hasn't even melted. Regarding fresh vs. frozen - I honestly do not know whether they have changed anything there, at least here in DE. If they did, I cannot taste the difference, and I regularly grind my own meat at home.
        nebula8804 3y ago
        In the video they use a seasoning that looks like it is more than salt (maybe salt + black pepper?). Maybe combine a big mac patty with that seasoning and you might get close to the original Quarter pounder? Also did you follow procedures for cooking like they do? (mainly crushing the patty on a grill). >That resting process gives them some time to meld together, I presume. To me, a good burger is a messy, fused together thing that looks as if someone has taken a nap on them. You can do that today by just putting the crushed patty into a warming bin. But its got to be something in the meat mixture that causes all that grease and taste you are looking for. You might be able to find that seasoning on eBay or make friends with someone who works at a mcDonalds and have them sneak out some of the seasoning or some of the uncooked patties so you can compare. At least that should be the proper thinking. If you watch all the videos in the channel above they essentially show every item being made. Its various combinations of mostly the same ingredients. My first job out of school was at a Wendys and I saw the same thing there. Small set of SKUs and all the menu items were various combinations of the same things. The old non freshly made patties have got to be similar to their regular cheeseburger/big mac patties because this is a fast food place so they must be keeping unique SKUs to a minimum. Wikipedia does state that the change in 2018 was a move to fresh beef with "preservatives removed". The way i'd start is by first ordering two items, a big mac with nothing but the meat as well as a quarter pounder with no meat. Then quickly put the patty on the quarter pounder(or just ask them to do this lol). Start with that as a taste test.
  - drekipus 3y ago
    Personally, having the buns, lettuce, sliced tomatoes, etc. are a little hassle. I've always find salad ingredients tricky to keep and maintain. Otherwise I would make my own burgers a lot more. (I seldom go to fast food places)
    - janfoeh 3y ago
      I had the very much the same problem, until our fridge died and the replacement I bought came with one of those temperature and humidity controlled vegetable drawers. I hadn't paid it any mind, since I assumed it was just some marketing gimmick. But much to my surprise, those things actually work — vegetables easily keep three times as long in them. Doesn't help with the buns, of course.
- williamdclt 3y ago
  > If I want cheap fast food I get a Döner Kebab for 4 Euros lucky you. In London, kebabs are routinely >£8 (I've seen >£10), and they are almost invariably terrible. My biggest gripe being that the bread (when it's actually a doner rather than a wrap) is a soft soggy waste of flour. For some reason they also insist on assembling the doner by putting bread at the bottom of a styrofoam box then piling up "fillings" on top of it, making it impossible to eat on the go. It's not like it's hard? They already have the right ingredients, I'm not even picky about quality, just get half-decent bread and you're good to go!
- mytailorisrich 3y ago
  Most McDonald's are local businesses and probably more law-abiding than random kebabs places (especially if you care about "lowly-paid migrants" and cleanliness)... McDonald's can be cheap-ist. The trick is to stay away from their headline burgers and ask for the simple hamburgers/cheeseburgers instead, which are massively cheaper. For instance, here a hamburger is £1.19, cheeseburger £1.39, medium fries £1.59. Cheap. But of course they focus your attention to fancier burgers which cost £5 to £7.
  - Ekaros 3y ago
    It helps that there is two layers of oversight. First you have state that want their taxes. But then there is also the McDonalds who want their cut and know pretty much all data. From expected sales, to I think how much raw ingredients have been ordered. So ordering too much waste will look suspicious.
  - ngcc_hk 3y ago
    Until recently, and since 1980s the cheapest is no meal deal just egg sausage burger.
- jamil7 3y ago
  I'm assuming you're in Germany. Where are you getting a Döner for 4 euros? Those also got hit with inflation pretty hard, at least here in Berlin. Gourmet burger would also be closer to 12-13 now I think not 9.
  - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
    No not in Germany. In Austria you can find plenty of places with 4 Euro Kebab in less fancy districts. Sometimes even less than 4 if you pick some dodgy places. It's definitely cheap here compared to most of EU. Quality is another topic though. Half of them have been found to have stool bacteria in them.
- sidkshatriya 3y ago
  > employing lowly paid migrants from the job center Feels a bit like casual vilification of migrants. “Lowly paid” migrants have a high motivation to get the job done properly. They need the money and are grateful for the job that some non-migrants would never consider. If the restaurant is dirty then management is probably to blame. Management in such situations has tyrannical power. They probably just haven’t prioritised cleanliness in the restaurants you seem to describe.
  - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
    Ah yes, can't even say anything with migrants in the context, before someone does some mental gymnastics to infer you must have something against them. No mate, read my comment again. I was vilifying the employers who focus exclusively on job center migrants because they're the most vulnerable to exploitation. Sincerely, a migrant.

I gave up on these garbage fast-food chains after the 2022 inflation skyrocket. A decent burger at McDs or BK in Europe today is now about 9 Euros, closer to gourmet burger prices at fancy local burger joints with red brick walls where the waiters have lumberjack shirts, beards and man-buns. But 9 Euros for McDs/BK is taking the mickey considering it's just some sorry-ass excuse for a burger, thrown together in a pinch from the cheapest possible ingredients, into a paper bag, in a loud, crowded, dirty joint, employing lowly paid migrants from the job center. It was convenient in the days when it was still cheap, but now it's just overpriced slop. If I want cheap fast food I get a Döner Kebab for 4 Euros, and this way I'm also supporting a local business not the fat margins of off-shore shareholders.

rwmj 3y ago
I don't get it anyway, burgers are about the simplest food to make yourself.
- janfoeh 3y ago
  _A_ burger? Sure. _The_ burger? Not by a long shot. I've been trying off and on for a year to recreate my platonic ideal of a burger, the (German) McD Quarterpounder with cheese of yore before they switched to their "made to order" system. I've yet to nail either the patty or the bun. Recreating something specific at home is non-trivial.
  - OJFord 3y ago
    But fortunately it's trivial to do better than that specific.
    - janfoeh 3y ago
      No, it isn't, which was my point entirely. Besides — are you American? If you are, you are unlikely to know what my _that_ even is. I have eaten at McDonalds in the US, and it's not an experience I would care to repeat. So if that's true, I can kinda see where you are coming from, but still - different strokes and all that jazz?
      - OJFord 3y ago
        I thought your point was about exact reproduction? I was being slightly snidely critical of fast food burgers in general, saying it's easy to make better. (If you really want exact, the only helpful things I can think of which I almost said are to add more/introduce sugar to the bun - yet somehow keep it more like a washing-up sponge than brioche - and cook the burger from frozen, it'll change the texture.) No, I'm British, I don't know how British McDonalds burgers compare to German ones, but it's probably almost 20y since I've had one anyway. I did have one in the Netherlands ..10y ago (though gosh, that visit feels much more recent!) which was certainly different to here, but y'know, it's still fast food.
        janfoeh 3y ago
        Adding more sugar to the buns is an interesting idea, thanks. I will give that a shot for my next batch. The texture of the patty is one of the things I have nailed; that was just a matter of adding salt into the mince instead of seasoning from the outside - that makes them a little denser, more meatloaf-like, like freezing would. And yeah, the regional differences are interesting. I had my last one in the Netherlands.. 21 years ago, and they still served them in styrofoam containers, many years after they had been phased out in Germany. And in Denmark, you could draft your own condiments into little waffle cones. Cute.
  - nebula8804 3y ago
    Fascinating! The made to order system has them cook the patty "fresh" as shown here: [1]: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IVRlYugm69Y https://youtube.com/watch?v=IVRlYugm69Y Just to be clear, are you trying to mimic the burger as it was made before this new system was introduced? Because that was just a frozen puck...
    - janfoeh 3y ago
      Right! I'm talking about the "batch-made burgers resting in a warming cabinet until sold" process. That resting process gives them some time to meld together, I presume. To me, a good burger is a messy, fused together thing that looks as if someone has taken a nap on them. With made-to-order, McDonalds not only lost the "fast" in "fast food", but the result is just some stack of components that is so lukewarm, half of the time the cheese hasn't even melted. Regarding fresh vs. frozen - I honestly do not know whether they have changed anything there, at least here in DE. If they did, I cannot taste the difference, and I regularly grind my own meat at home.
      - nebula8804 3y ago
        In the video they use a seasoning that looks like it is more than salt (maybe salt + black pepper?). Maybe combine a big mac patty with that seasoning and you might get close to the original Quarter pounder? Also did you follow procedures for cooking like they do? (mainly crushing the patty on a grill). >That resting process gives them some time to meld together, I presume. To me, a good burger is a messy, fused together thing that looks as if someone has taken a nap on them. You can do that today by just putting the crushed patty into a warming bin. But its got to be something in the meat mixture that causes all that grease and taste you are looking for. You might be able to find that seasoning on eBay or make friends with someone who works at a mcDonalds and have them sneak out some of the seasoning or some of the uncooked patties so you can compare. At least that should be the proper thinking. If you watch all the videos in the channel above they essentially show every item being made. Its various combinations of mostly the same ingredients. My first job out of school was at a Wendys and I saw the same thing there. Small set of SKUs and all the menu items were various combinations of the same things. The old non freshly made patties have got to be similar to their regular cheeseburger/big mac patties because this is a fast food place so they must be keeping unique SKUs to a minimum. Wikipedia does state that the change in 2018 was a move to fresh beef with "preservatives removed". The way i'd start is by first ordering two items, a big mac with nothing but the meat as well as a quarter pounder with no meat. Then quickly put the patty on the quarter pounder(or just ask them to do this lol). Start with that as a taste test.
- drekipus 3y ago
  Personally, having the buns, lettuce, sliced tomatoes, etc. are a little hassle. I've always find salad ingredients tricky to keep and maintain. Otherwise I would make my own burgers a lot more. (I seldom go to fast food places)
  - janfoeh 3y ago
    I had the very much the same problem, until our fridge died and the replacement I bought came with one of those temperature and humidity controlled vegetable drawers. I hadn't paid it any mind, since I assumed it was just some marketing gimmick. But much to my surprise, those things actually work — vegetables easily keep three times as long in them. Doesn't help with the buns, of course.
williamdclt 3y ago
> If I want cheap fast food I get a Döner Kebab for 4 Euros lucky you. In London, kebabs are routinely >£8 (I've seen >£10), and they are almost invariably terrible. My biggest gripe being that the bread (when it's actually a doner rather than a wrap) is a soft soggy waste of flour. For some reason they also insist on assembling the doner by putting bread at the bottom of a styrofoam box then piling up "fillings" on top of it, making it impossible to eat on the go. It's not like it's hard? They already have the right ingredients, I'm not even picky about quality, just get half-decent bread and you're good to go!
mytailorisrich 3y ago
Most McDonald's are local businesses and probably more law-abiding than random kebabs places (especially if you care about "lowly-paid migrants" and cleanliness)... McDonald's can be cheap-ist. The trick is to stay away from their headline burgers and ask for the simple hamburgers/cheeseburgers instead, which are massively cheaper. For instance, here a hamburger is £1.19, cheeseburger £1.39, medium fries £1.59. Cheap. But of course they focus your attention to fancier burgers which cost £5 to £7.
- Ekaros 3y ago
  It helps that there is two layers of oversight. First you have state that want their taxes. But then there is also the McDonalds who want their cut and know pretty much all data. From expected sales, to I think how much raw ingredients have been ordered. So ordering too much waste will look suspicious.
- ngcc_hk 3y ago
  Until recently, and since 1980s the cheapest is no meal deal just egg sausage burger.
jamil7 3y ago
I'm assuming you're in Germany. Where are you getting a Döner for 4 euros? Those also got hit with inflation pretty hard, at least here in Berlin. Gourmet burger would also be closer to 12-13 now I think not 9.
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  No not in Germany. In Austria you can find plenty of places with 4 Euro Kebab in less fancy districts. Sometimes even less than 4 if you pick some dodgy places. It's definitely cheap here compared to most of EU. Quality is another topic though. Half of them have been found to have stool bacteria in them.
sidkshatriya 3y ago
> employing lowly paid migrants from the job center Feels a bit like casual vilification of migrants. “Lowly paid” migrants have a high motivation to get the job done properly. They need the money and are grateful for the job that some non-migrants would never consider. If the restaurant is dirty then management is probably to blame. Management in such situations has tyrannical power. They probably just haven’t prioritised cleanliness in the restaurants you seem to describe.
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  Ah yes, can't even say anything with migrants in the context, before someone does some mental gymnastics to infer you must have something against them. No mate, read my comment again. I was vilifying the employers who focus exclusively on job center migrants because they're the most vulnerable to exploitation. Sincerely, a migrant.