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It's the same for doing work on your house. If you're the owner you don't need to be licensed to do most repairs or renovations but to work on other people's ho

by Spivak 3y ago

It's the same for doing work on your house. If you're the owner you don't need to be licensed to do most repairs or renovations but to work on other people's houses you need certification. Not saying it's a good system, just that it's consistent.

idiotsecant 3y ago
No, this would be like if the city's electrical supply house got to choose what counted as an electrical qualification.
ClumsyPilot 3y ago
The difference being is that electricians are certified by a real and reputable body and manufacturers don’t get to pick and choose. No doubt they will weaponise this ability
- samatman 3y ago
  No they won't. The disconnect between computer programming and law is a rich and perennial source of amusement here on Hacker News. What happens if the manufacturer decides to be unreasonable, by saying that no industry standard of certification is acceptable, or just the one organization they founded themselves, or that sort of thing, is that they get a sharply-worded letter from the Oregon DA. If they don't sort it out then legal action will be taken. So they're not going to do that in the first place, because everyone actually involved in this stuff already knows that. The law isn't compiled. Its function relies on a common understanding of context which is the major course of study in law school. If a CEO ordered a company to do the sort of thing you're proposing, it would be against the advice of council.
  - autoexec 3y ago
    > What happens if the manufacturer decides to be unreasonable, by saying that no industry standard of certification is acceptable, or just the one organization they founded themselves, or that sort of thing, is that they get a sharply-worded letter from the Oregon DA That assumes that the Oregon DA isn't collecting a bunch of campaign funds, gifts, etc from Apple in which case the DA will do nothing and taking apple to court yourself will likely end in a loss since our legal system is often pay to win and apple can out-spend you. >If a CEO ordered a company to do the sort of thing you're proposing, it would be against the advice of council. CEOs often break the law because they (and their council) know the risks of getting caught are small and/or that if they are caught the worst punishment they'll face is a fine which won't come anywhere close to the amount of money they'll make by breaking the law. Generally, it's a good thing that laws are subject to interpretation by humans and not treated like code written for machines because we want flexibility, but without enough oversight and accountability that doesn't work out so well for us either.

by Spivak 3y ago

idiotsecant 3y ago

No, this would be like if the city's electrical supply house got to choose what counted as an electrical qualification.

ClumsyPilot 3y ago

The difference being is that electricians are certified by a real and reputable body and manufacturers don’t get to pick and choose. No doubt they will weaponise this ability

samatman 3y ago
No they won't. The disconnect between computer programming and law is a rich and perennial source of amusement here on Hacker News. What happens if the manufacturer decides to be unreasonable, by saying that no industry standard of certification is acceptable, or just the one organization they founded themselves, or that sort of thing, is that they get a sharply-worded letter from the Oregon DA. If they don't sort it out then legal action will be taken. So they're not going to do that in the first place, because everyone actually involved in this stuff already knows that. The law isn't compiled. Its function relies on a common understanding of context which is the major course of study in law school. If a CEO ordered a company to do the sort of thing you're proposing, it would be against the advice of council.
- autoexec 3y ago
  > What happens if the manufacturer decides to be unreasonable, by saying that no industry standard of certification is acceptable, or just the one organization they founded themselves, or that sort of thing, is that they get a sharply-worded letter from the Oregon DA That assumes that the Oregon DA isn't collecting a bunch of campaign funds, gifts, etc from Apple in which case the DA will do nothing and taking apple to court yourself will likely end in a loss since our legal system is often pay to win and apple can out-spend you. >If a CEO ordered a company to do the sort of thing you're proposing, it would be against the advice of council. CEOs often break the law because they (and their council) know the risks of getting caught are small and/or that if they are caught the worst punishment they'll face is a fine which won't come anywhere close to the amount of money they'll make by breaking the law. Generally, it's a good thing that laws are subject to interpretation by humans and not treated like code written for machines because we want flexibility, but without enough oversight and accountability that doesn't work out so well for us either.