4 ms·

Knowing both sides of the argument around this topic and apple, it's not hard to understand why apple has a compelling argument and why it still deserves to be

Knowing both sides of the argument around this topic and apple, it's not hard to understand why apple has a compelling argument and why it still deserves to be heard. You have to remember that tons of people have near zero tech awareness, and regardless of the laws, will just bring their iPhone to the Apple store if it breaks. The same way people still go to dealers to fix their car, even out of warranty. This means Apple can say "Hey, give us full control of your phone repairs, and we can kill the theft market for iPhones. You are going to come to us anyway, so might as well let us end iPhone theft too" So this is why lawmakers still sit down with Apple. And the generous lunches. (Apple DRM'ing all the internal hardware does effectively make stolen iphones completely worthless, in whole or in parts.) -For the record, I have personally written my senator before asking him to support right to repair laws.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
lotsofpulp 3y ago
I wonder what would happen if the law required devices with unpaired parts to be available, but still allowing the sale of devices with paired parts.
- Someone 3y ago
  If there would be enough unpaired devices in the wild, both types of devices would get stolen (or, worse, robbed, with risk of bodily harm). Thieves would not return the ones that are worthless to them to their owners (why would they take that risk?). So, it would make the protection worthless for those willing to opt-in. And no, making it somewhat easy to check whether a phone is locked down wouldn’t help. Thieves and robbers won’t spend even a second to do that check while still near the crime scene. It would have to be absolutely obvious (say by having orange and black devices) for thieves to not steal the locked-down ones.
  - charcircuit 3y ago
    Presumably the unpaired parts would pair after being installed
lnxg33k1 3y ago
Apple has had the full control on supply, and it hasn’t killed the theft market, the same way having control on anything you can install on a iGadget has killed the scam industry, so if we need to get a phone stolen, might as well make it repairable, how long since we start classifying apple arguments as pure marketing detached from reality?
dns_snek 3y ago
> (Apple DRM'ing all the internal hardware does effectively make stolen iphones completely worthless, in whole or in parts.) This claim, or to be more specific, the claim that this reduces theft, is missing evidence. Are iPhones really being stolen at a substantially lower rate than other brands, correlating with implementation of these locks?
- pchristensen 3y ago
  Lots of articles starting 2013 that Activation Lock reduced theft by measurable amounts. I couldn't figure out how to search for articles about drm'ed parts.
- tombert 3y ago
  Sample size of one, and anecdotal at that, but someone snatched my iPhone out of my hands last July and ran away. I of course reported it stolen to the police and locked it down in FindMy, so in theory I think it's a brick, but I don't think that the fact that it was an iPhone really deterred them from stealing it from me. They actually tried to extort $300 from me to get it back which I of course would not pay, but maybe there's still a market in that for some people?
  - CatWChainsaw 3y ago
    How did they try to get $300 from you after your phone was stolen? You probably don't carry that much cash on you, they can't text you, and they have your phone/digital wallet if they wanted to try cracking it.
    - tombert 3y ago
      After I got home, I got my wife to call the phone, and they said they would give it back to me if I gave them $300. We were trying to see if we could figure out a way to get them to reveal themselves but it didn’t pan out.
      - CatWChainsaw 3y ago
jancsika 3y ago
> So this is why lawmakers still sit down with Apple. And the generous lunches. I have to say, this sounds trivially false, and I don't think I'm nitpicking. Lawmakers sit down with Apple because Apple has an enormous amount of money and power. After some of these lawmakers sit down for lunch with the lobbyist, perhaps they make the assessment that what Apple is asking for is still doable/ethical/practical/etc. Edit: clarification

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

lotsofpulp 3y ago

I wonder what would happen if the law required devices with unpaired parts to be available, but still allowing the sale of devices with paired parts.

Someone 3y ago
If there would be enough unpaired devices in the wild, both types of devices would get stolen (or, worse, robbed, with risk of bodily harm). Thieves would not return the ones that are worthless to them to their owners (why would they take that risk?). So, it would make the protection worthless for those willing to opt-in. And no, making it somewhat easy to check whether a phone is locked down wouldn’t help. Thieves and robbers won’t spend even a second to do that check while still near the crime scene. It would have to be absolutely obvious (say by having orange and black devices) for thieves to not steal the locked-down ones.
- charcircuit 3y ago
  Presumably the unpaired parts would pair after being installed

lnxg33k1 3y ago

Apple has had the full control on supply, and it hasn’t killed the theft market, the same way having control on anything you can install on a iGadget has killed the scam industry, so if we need to get a phone stolen, might as well make it repairable, how long since we start classifying apple arguments as pure marketing detached from reality?

dns_snek 3y ago

> (Apple DRM'ing all the internal hardware does effectively make stolen iphones completely worthless, in whole or in parts.) This claim, or to be more specific, the claim that this reduces theft, is missing evidence. Are iPhones really being stolen at a substantially lower rate than other brands, correlating with implementation of these locks?

pchristensen 3y ago
Lots of articles starting 2013 that Activation Lock reduced theft by measurable amounts. I couldn't figure out how to search for articles about drm'ed parts.
tombert 3y ago
Sample size of one, and anecdotal at that, but someone snatched my iPhone out of my hands last July and ran away. I of course reported it stolen to the police and locked it down in FindMy, so in theory I think it's a brick, but I don't think that the fact that it was an iPhone really deterred them from stealing it from me. They actually tried to extort $300 from me to get it back which I of course would not pay, but maybe there's still a market in that for some people?
- CatWChainsaw 3y ago
  How did they try to get $300 from you after your phone was stolen? You probably don't carry that much cash on you, they can't text you, and they have your phone/digital wallet if they wanted to try cracking it.
  - tombert 3y ago
    After I got home, I got my wife to call the phone, and they said they would give it back to me if I gave them $300. We were trying to see if we could figure out a way to get them to reveal themselves but it didn’t pan out.
    - CatWChainsaw 3y ago

jancsika 3y ago

> So this is why lawmakers still sit down with Apple. And the generous lunches. I have to say, this sounds trivially false, and I don't think I'm nitpicking. Lawmakers sit down with Apple because Apple has an enormous amount of money and power. After some of these lawmakers sit down for lunch with the lobbyist, perhaps they make the assessment that what Apple is asking for is still doable/ethical/practical/etc. Edit: clarification