4 ms·

This is absolutely appalling. I can't believe such blatant violation of privacy and human rights is happening in Sweden.

boxed 3y ago
The article is quite confused about how Swedish law has worked for hundreds of years. Address, person numbers (which encode birthday), income, these are all public records. Have been for over a hundred years. It's not a big deal or scandal. In combination with our freedom of information laws (which actually are that, unlike the ones in the US that are super weak), these make it quite easy for journalists to find and expose corruption. For en example read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Guillou#The_IB_affair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Guillou#The_IB_affair
- lou1306 3y ago
  The problem I see is companies harvesting these records and profiting from making them available over the Internet. Maybe just add a rate limit to how many such requests a single entity may apply for?
  - boxed 3y ago
    That's how the state does it yea.
- veeti 3y ago
  The word "Stockholm syndrome" has never been more appropriate.
  - Jensson 3y ago
    Open information makes societies more efficient, it isn't only a bad thing. There isn't much bad you can do with that information since every system assumes it is open, most of the bad things that can happen with such information comes from the assumption that it is private so companies starts to use it as proof that you are you.
    - veeti 3y ago
      Can I have your home address and payslips for the last 20 years? Please respond with this information directly below.
      - yaris 3y ago
        Neither are public information. The current registered address is, amount of taxes paid - yes, these are public (although for the latter you have to pay some very small fee, IIRC).
        veeti 3y ago
        I don't know about you, but for the vast majority of people their "current registered address" also happens to be their home.
        yaris 3y ago
        I believe it varies between countries. Where I live the actual address does not really matter for most intents and purposes, what matters is one's registered address because that's where paper post goes, and more and more people use e-post even for government communications. Where my parents live it is actually quite common to _not_ live where one is registered, especially among younger generations, this is because police first comes after you to the registered address, and police in that country is often more dangerous than "no police". So I do not speak for the "vast majority" but for the people around me.
        veeti 3y ago
        Case in point: if you are well off enough to rent or own multiple properties you have the privilege of not being doxxed by these brokers. Tell me again how knowing 18 year old Sven Svensson earning $10k a year at a part time job and renting in flat B69 is oh so essential for an open society again.
      - geon 3y ago
alkonaut 3y ago
I don't think the public nature of these figures (like, my address, or taxable income) is even contested here. Or, that would be a different discussion. The question is rather whether pieces of information which is public from authorities (Some which are common in many countries such as court records, others which are more unique to Sweden such as addresses) should be legal to index and make searchable, at third parties. This is where the GDPR is an issue. And I agree strongly with noyb here. I can't see how any of these companies have any journalistic goals.

boxed 3y ago

The article is quite confused about how Swedish law has worked for hundreds of years. Address, person numbers (which encode birthday), income, these are all public records. Have been for over a hundred years. It's not a big deal or scandal. In combination with our freedom of information laws (which actually are that, unlike the ones in the US that are super weak), these make it quite easy for journalists to find and expose corruption. For en example read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Guillou#The_IB_affair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Guillou#The_IB_affair

lou1306 3y ago
The problem I see is companies harvesting these records and profiting from making them available over the Internet. Maybe just add a rate limit to how many such requests a single entity may apply for?
- boxed 3y ago
  That's how the state does it yea.
veeti 3y ago
The word "Stockholm syndrome" has never been more appropriate.
- Jensson 3y ago
  Open information makes societies more efficient, it isn't only a bad thing. There isn't much bad you can do with that information since every system assumes it is open, most of the bad things that can happen with such information comes from the assumption that it is private so companies starts to use it as proof that you are you.
  - veeti 3y ago
    Can I have your home address and payslips for the last 20 years? Please respond with this information directly below.
    - yaris 3y ago
      Neither are public information. The current registered address is, amount of taxes paid - yes, these are public (although for the latter you have to pay some very small fee, IIRC).
      - veeti 3y ago
        I don't know about you, but for the vast majority of people their "current registered address" also happens to be their home.
        yaris 3y ago
        I believe it varies between countries. Where I live the actual address does not really matter for most intents and purposes, what matters is one's registered address because that's where paper post goes, and more and more people use e-post even for government communications. Where my parents live it is actually quite common to _not_ live where one is registered, especially among younger generations, this is because police first comes after you to the registered address, and police in that country is often more dangerous than "no police". So I do not speak for the "vast majority" but for the people around me.
        veeti 3y ago
        Case in point: if you are well off enough to rent or own multiple properties you have the privilege of not being doxxed by these brokers. Tell me again how knowing 18 year old Sven Svensson earning $10k a year at a part time job and renting in flat B69 is oh so essential for an open society again.
    - geon 3y ago

alkonaut 3y ago

I don't think the public nature of these figures (like, my address, or taxable income) is even contested here. Or, that would be a different discussion. The question is rather whether pieces of information which is public from authorities (Some which are common in many countries such as court records, others which are more unique to Sweden such as addresses) should be legal to index and make searchable, at third parties. This is where the GDPR is an issue. And I agree strongly with noyb here. I can't see how any of these companies have any journalistic goals.