3 ms·

Is there trusted hardware a company could buy that is completely open-source, including hardware design and checks, so white-hats could identify any mishaps wi

Is there trusted hardware a company could buy that is completely open-source, including hardware design and checks, so white-hats could identify any mishaps with it?

shimon_e 14y ago
Have you read trusting trust?
- eneveu 14y ago
  "Reflections on Trusting Trust", Ken Thompson's 1983 Turing Award lecture: http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/ken/trust.html http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/ken/trust.html Also, there is an interesting article on trusting hardware ( http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.fr/2009/03/trusting-hardware.html http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.fr/2009/03/trusting-hardw... ) which was reposted two months ago on HN ( http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3656522 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3656522 ).
- fdr 14y ago
  Even then, trusting trust is not really all that undetectable in a world of different compilers and different hardware. Or, perhaps more accurately, the power of the adversary has to increase by a lot to maintain the illusion of non-infection. http://www.acsa-admin.org/2005/abstracts/47.html http://www.acsa-admin.org/2005/abstracts/47.html
raphman 14y ago
The Openmoko phones are AFAIK the only mobile phones with open source hardware. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page
- uvdiv 14y ago
  They're not open-source hardware in that sense. What they publish is a 19-page pdf of schematics of how the components are put together [1] -- and even that has redactions due to NDAs (like page 14 -- the say they have a "super NDA" with the GSM chip provider that bans them from even publishing the datasheet!) The components themselves (like the Samsung SoC and the GSM chip) are completely closed. "Open" in that they show you how they put together the black boxes. "Closed" because it's all made up of black boxes. [1] http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware#Hardware_Specification http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware#Hardwa... [2] http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-January/002653.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-January/0...

Is there trusted hardware a company could buy that is completely open-source, including hardware design and checks, so white-hats could identify any mishaps with it?

shimon_e 14y ago

Have you read trusting trust?

eneveu 14y ago
"Reflections on Trusting Trust", Ken Thompson's 1983 Turing Award lecture: http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/ken/trust.html http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/ken/trust.html Also, there is an interesting article on trusting hardware ( http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.fr/2009/03/trusting-hardware.html http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.fr/2009/03/trusting-hardw... ) which was reposted two months ago on HN ( http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3656522 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3656522 ).
fdr 14y ago
Even then, trusting trust is not really all that undetectable in a world of different compilers and different hardware. Or, perhaps more accurately, the power of the adversary has to increase by a lot to maintain the illusion of non-infection. http://www.acsa-admin.org/2005/abstracts/47.html http://www.acsa-admin.org/2005/abstracts/47.html

raphman 14y ago

The Openmoko phones are AFAIK the only mobile phones with open source hardware. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page

uvdiv 14y ago
They're not open-source hardware in that sense. What they publish is a 19-page pdf of schematics of how the components are put together [1] -- and even that has redactions due to NDAs (like page 14 -- the say they have a "super NDA" with the GSM chip provider that bans them from even publishing the datasheet!) The components themselves (like the Samsung SoC and the GSM chip) are completely closed. "Open" in that they show you how they put together the black boxes. "Closed" because it's all made up of black boxes. [1] http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware#Hardware_Specification http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware#Hardwa... [2] http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-January/002653.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-January/0...