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I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. Nicely distributed in small chunks to abide to the letter of (labour) law. I would not be surp

I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. Nicely distributed in small chunks to abide to the letter of (labour) law. I would not be surprised to find similar structures leveraging Amazon or Google posing as small shops. Apple choosing to splinter their app store rules, eulas regionally doesn't make it easier (for them) to surveil and control their Apple cosmos either.

fauigerzigerk 3y ago
>I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. No, Siemens is not a criminal organisation running a web of hidden shell companies. Siemens is a conglomerate comprising a large number of subsidiaries and associated companies that they publish right on their website [1]. I have no doubt that large companies use complicated structures in order to exploit loopholes. But there are limits to that, especially as Apple doesn't require a complex lawmaking process in order to change their ToS. They can close a loophole at the stroke of a pen. And they can close developer accounts at will if ToS are violated. [1] https://assets.new.siemens.com/siemens/assets/api/uuid:830cf1d4-b5b4-49ae-8958-c4391a170831/abesitz2008-313-e-081118a.pdf https://assets.new.siemens.com/siemens/assets/api/uuid:830cf...
- repelsteeltje 3y ago
  The speed at which apple can alter their ToS is indeed a key differentiator. Any cartel instantly becomes a criminal cartel if governance over laws/EULAs is basically absent and biased against the cartel. [added] Not saying Siemens is nefarious, but they do seem to be subverting the spirit of law. The conglomerate sure makes it easy to "reorganize" without due process for firing lots of employees.
cyberax 3y ago
> I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. Nicely distributed in small chunks to abide to the letter of (labour) law. Siemens is not a good example. If you're looking for better examples, there's Aldi. It intentionally splits its structure to avoid triggering stricter labor and reporting laws.

fauigerzigerk 3y ago

>I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. No, Siemens is not a criminal organisation running a web of hidden shell companies. Siemens is a conglomerate comprising a large number of subsidiaries and associated companies that they publish right on their website [1]. I have no doubt that large companies use complicated structures in order to exploit loopholes. But there are limits to that, especially as Apple doesn't require a complex lawmaking process in order to change their ToS. They can close a loophole at the stroke of a pen. And they can close developer accounts at will if ToS are violated. [1] https://assets.new.siemens.com/siemens/assets/api/uuid:830cf1d4-b5b4-49ae-8958-c4391a170831/abesitz2008-313-e-081118a.pdf https://assets.new.siemens.com/siemens/assets/api/uuid:830cf...

repelsteeltje 3y ago
The speed at which apple can alter their ToS is indeed a key differentiator. Any cartel instantly becomes a criminal cartel if governance over laws/EULAs is basically absent and biased against the cartel. [added] Not saying Siemens is nefarious, but they do seem to be subverting the spirit of law. The conglomerate sure makes it easy to "reorganize" without due process for firing lots of employees.

cyberax 3y ago

> I think Siemens Germany is a nice example of just such a cartel. Nicely distributed in small chunks to abide to the letter of (labour) law. Siemens is not a good example. If you're looking for better examples, there's Aldi. It intentionally splits its structure to avoid triggering stricter labor and reporting laws.