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> The walled garden is why I chose an iPhone And that's fine The feature is not for you You can keep using your iPhone as you always did, through the Apple a

> The walled garden is why I chose an iPhone And that's fine The feature is not for you You can keep using your iPhone as you always did, through the Apple app store But, there's a but: how many users would answer "no" to "would you like to download our app and get a 30% discount for the same exact features"?

acover 3y ago
Are they forced to list on the apple app store?
- littlestymaar 3y ago
  Good thing is you're not forced to use them either!
  - acover 3y ago
    Do you consider the usage of oligopolies optional? I could live the life of stallman, but this decision kills an amazing user experience for subscriptions.
    - littlestymaar 3y ago
      The European commission has you covered on the oligopolies side. It's not killing user experience at all, if the user want, they can use the App store, because few if any app will ever make a complete move away from the App store, it would cost them way too much. The only ones that could pull such a trick are DMA's “gatekeeper” apps and they are under scrutiny from the EC, so you're safe here. (Well, Fortnite doesn't fall under DMA's 10 “gateway services” that deserve scrutiny from the DMA, but their alternative store will!)
nerdjon 3y ago
Unless I am mistaken, there is nothing here that says a developer has to continue to also have their app on the App Store and allow purchasing through the App Store in addition to their own billing. Meaning, no I actually won't be able to use my iPhone as I always did once this becomes normalized and accepted. Please correct me if I am wrong about what the rule for this actually is.
- hu3 3y ago
  You're not forced to purchase apps. So if the developer is misbehaving, don't buy it.
- yau8edq12i 3y ago
  Vote with your wallet, then. Only buy apps distributed through the Apple app store if you dislike alternative stores.
  - nerdjon 3y ago
    So again this is about giving the developer choice and not users. If a developer chooses to use an alternative store, even if I want to use that app, the choice is made for me to not use it. How exactly is this benefiting users?
    - ryanjshaw 3y ago
      The problem is your friend Apple locking up their subscription services behind fees that developers don't want to pay. And please don't tell me they need that money to run the service - a quick look at their profit numbers tells you the margin is significant. Apple could fix this overnight and choose not to. Therefore they clearly don't care about their users, by your definitions. Also: who do you think you are to tell developers how much money they're allowed to make? It's their right to decide whether they want to pay these platform fees or not.
      - nerdjon 3y ago
        And again we are back to the developers and not the users, thank you for proving my initial point here. I am the user that doesn't want to be taken advantage of by developers who choose to engage in dark patterns. I frankly don't care how much of a cut Apple takes from payments. Just like I don't care about how much my grocery store uncharges, I don't care what Steam, Xbox, Playstation, or any other marketplace charges. That isn't on me as the User. I want an experience that I am not at the mercy of developers who have been known to employ dark patterns. This isn't a theoretical thing, it is very much a thing. That is my problem here. This is NOT about choice for users, this about choice for developers. Meaning my options are being removed from me...

acover 3y ago

Are they forced to list on the apple app store?

littlestymaar 3y ago
Good thing is you're not forced to use them either!
- acover 3y ago
  Do you consider the usage of oligopolies optional? I could live the life of stallman, but this decision kills an amazing user experience for subscriptions.
  - littlestymaar 3y ago
    The European commission has you covered on the oligopolies side. It's not killing user experience at all, if the user want, they can use the App store, because few if any app will ever make a complete move away from the App store, it would cost them way too much. The only ones that could pull such a trick are DMA's “gatekeeper” apps and they are under scrutiny from the EC, so you're safe here. (Well, Fortnite doesn't fall under DMA's 10 “gateway services” that deserve scrutiny from the DMA, but their alternative store will!)

nerdjon 3y ago

Unless I am mistaken, there is nothing here that says a developer has to continue to also have their app on the App Store and allow purchasing through the App Store in addition to their own billing. Meaning, no I actually won't be able to use my iPhone as I always did once this becomes normalized and accepted. Please correct me if I am wrong about what the rule for this actually is.

hu3 3y ago
You're not forced to purchase apps. So if the developer is misbehaving, don't buy it.
yau8edq12i 3y ago
Vote with your wallet, then. Only buy apps distributed through the Apple app store if you dislike alternative stores.
- nerdjon 3y ago
  So again this is about giving the developer choice and not users. If a developer chooses to use an alternative store, even if I want to use that app, the choice is made for me to not use it. How exactly is this benefiting users?
  - ryanjshaw 3y ago
    The problem is your friend Apple locking up their subscription services behind fees that developers don't want to pay. And please don't tell me they need that money to run the service - a quick look at their profit numbers tells you the margin is significant. Apple could fix this overnight and choose not to. Therefore they clearly don't care about their users, by your definitions. Also: who do you think you are to tell developers how much money they're allowed to make? It's their right to decide whether they want to pay these platform fees or not.
    - nerdjon 3y ago
      And again we are back to the developers and not the users, thank you for proving my initial point here. I am the user that doesn't want to be taken advantage of by developers who choose to engage in dark patterns. I frankly don't care how much of a cut Apple takes from payments. Just like I don't care about how much my grocery store uncharges, I don't care what Steam, Xbox, Playstation, or any other marketplace charges. That isn't on me as the User. I want an experience that I am not at the mercy of developers who have been known to employ dark patterns. This isn't a theoretical thing, it is very much a thing. That is my problem here. This is NOT about choice for users, this about choice for developers. Meaning my options are being removed from me...