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A Mistake in a Tesla and a Panicked Final Call: The Death of Angela Chao

32 points by yakshaving_jgt 3y ago

yakshaving_jgt 3y ago
https://archive.is/x0lvr https://archive.is/x0lvr
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
tromp 3y ago
> buying an Italianate mansion downtown and a sprawling ranch just under an hour west. TIL that Italianate means "Italian in character or appearance".
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- INTPenis 3y ago
  Sort of like Jordan Schlansky.
bigyikes 3y ago
She put the Tesla in reverse by mistake and backed into a pond.
- ghaff 3y ago
  The Tesla part seems pretty incidental to this unless their gear controls are unusually confusing and easy to misuse. My Honda controls are not the conventional automatic shift--although Reverse is very clearly differentiated from Drive and it would be hard to press one rather than the other absent just a real mental error.
  - gnicholas 3y ago
    I thought the bigger issue was the inability to escape the vehicle once it was underwater. I don’t know the extent to which (1) heavier EVs sink faster than similar-class ICE vehicles, (2) EVs generally are hard to get out of because windows lack manual controls compared to ICE vehicles, or (3) Teslas are particularly lacking in escape mechanisms. Seems like the lesson is to have a window hammer and to break the window before the vehicle fills with water.
    - rkagerer 3y ago
      My dad keeps a hammer in his Tesla to break a window in case he's trapped in without the windows working.
      - sroussey 3y ago
        Will that work in a Cybertruck?
        rkagerer 3y ago
        Can't promise, but since a steel ball just about broke through I imagine a few determined thwacks with a sledgehammer would do it. https://youtu.be/BqGf8pqCZi0 https://youtu.be/BqGf8pqCZi0
    - dangus 3y ago
      The electronic door poppers should be illegal. They’re so clearly a safety hazard with no cost or function/ease of use upside. Other brands that aren’t Tesla don’t go to such great lengths to hide the emergency releases, too.
    - leohonexus 3y ago
      Model X's laminated glass is near impossible to break underwater according to the article. Instead of a window hammer, in the US you could probably use a handgun to shatter the glass instead. The Cybertruck though uses "bulletproof glass", so you can't even shoot your way to escape - it'll just make a hole to make the car sink faster.
- lostlogin 3y ago
  The person who wrote the article may have been paid by the word. It would be interesting to read a publication which paid staff to convey the message efficiently.
  - Triphibian 3y ago
    It would but the incentives of the Internet (SEO, clickbait, etc.) broke the "inverted pyramid" philosophy in journalism.
nullc 3y ago
How do the shifters work in teslas? A lot of the more recent shifters I've seen in cars just seem very dangerous compared to classic designs-- no feedback, etc. I'm kinda surprised a ranch property wasn't equipt to get a car out of the water or break its windows.
- jvanderbot 3y ago
  In mine, you press up to shift into reverse, and down to shift into drive, and there are no other options since there's no such thing as "gears" per se. It's super noticeable when you go into reverse, because all screens become backup cameras and the mirrors tilt down so you can see your rear corners. It may play a different ding noise when you shift one vs the other but I can't recall.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - stefan_ 3y ago
    Also, you know, humans are perfectly capable of knowing they are moving backwards. Some sort or sensor fusion SLAM Kalman filter AI in the brain.
- cnasc 3y ago
  Article says she had a Tesla Model X. Looking online, it appears you shift by either using the touchscreen or some small capacitive buttons that are probably easy to mispress[1]. This is a radical opinion, but that’s the sort of UX malfeasance that should be punished by drawing and quartering even if it doesn’t result in a customer’s death. [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCo3EngU0E https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCo3EngU0E
  - ein0p 3y ago
    It's not a "button", it's a slider. It's not easy to "mispress". And I don't think that slider is present on older Model X, so she probably pushed the stalk up to go into reverse. Which IMO is less confusing than most automatic shifter levers, where you have to remember than pulling it _back_ makes the car go forward.
hindsightbias 3y ago
So are the conspiracies that Tesla is a Saneer-Weeksbooth assasination front, China kills their trade partners kids, threat to force Mitch McConnell out, or… I don’t want to delve into 4chan, Hedge fund TX billionaire rantings or Johnson City diner counter theories.
- tzs 3y ago
  You probably should have mentioned that the article talks a little about the conspiracy theories that have been circulating about this incident, but does not go into much detail about them, and that you are asking for more detail. Most people reading the comments here probably have not read the article, and are going to miss that you are asking for more details rather then pushing conspiracy theories yourself.
dist-epoch 3y ago
> In 2016, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration denied a petition to require carmakers to equip every vehicle with a glass-breaking tool, saying the effectiveness of such a tool isn't known. That's some bizarre logic. Demand that the tool be effective, industry can get together and design a proper tool.
- stefan_ 3y ago
  I suppose the logic is more that the amount of people able to save themselves, even given the tool, is a rather low number.
- gnicholas 3y ago
  Having seen more than a few bipping videos, I am inclined to think that there are extremely 'effective' ways to shatter car glass. It's possible this trick doesn't work on laminated glass used in Teslas and other higher-end vehicles, but I've heard of Teslas getting hit — especially the rear corner windows, which give access to the trunk.
mysteria 3y ago
> While making a three-point turn, she had put the car in reverse instead of drive, she said. It is a mistake she had made before with the Tesla gearshift. The car had zipped backward, tipping over an embankment and into a pond. I've shifted to the wrong gear before during parking and so forth, luckily not causing an accident but it caused me to reevaluate my methods. Now after shifting (on an automatic) I let my foot off the brake and let the car creep a little bit before adding throttle if required. If I was in the wrong gear I would step on the brake immediately and the car would only have moved a couple inches. Yes many vehicles have a electronic display on the dash showing the selected gear but an additional confirmation is always the safest. It's like how you shouldn't completely rely on the hot surface light on a stove or the loaded chamber indicator on a handgun. The article also seemed to imply that Chao applied a decent amount of throttle right after shifting gears, causing the car to careen into the pond before she could react. While I can't speak for the exact conditions here but that's not something you should do especially at night with poor visibility.
- y-c-o-m-b 3y ago
  When I picked up my '23 Model Y, by default it's set not to creep and since it's single-pedal driving, lifting a foot off the brake does nothing. I have my Tesla in "chill mode" though, so I can lightly press the pedal and it'll accelerate very slowly.
jeffbee 3y ago
Suicide by deregulation, essentially.
johnea 3y ago
The primary point of the article seems to be that the WSJ authors were shocked to discover that even rich people can drown if they drive their car into a pond. Maybe if she had put the window down, instead of texting her friends, she would have lived? Reality once again demonstrated it's priority over modern make believe life. It's sad that this person lost their life because of this...
1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
assets.msn.com faster than wsj.com; for me, yes; ymmv https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-mistake-in-a-tesla-and-a-panicked-final-call-the-death-of-angela-chao/ar-BB1jAkIW https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-mistake-in-a-tesla-and-a... Text-only, no Javascript: tnftp -o'|grep -Eo "\"body\":\".+\"readTimeMin\""' \ https://assets.msn.com/content/view/v2/Detail/en-in/BB1jAkIW \ |(echo "<meta charset=utf-8>";sed 's/\"body\":\"//;s/\\//g; s/\",\"readTimeMin\"//') > 1.htm firefox ./1.htm links -force-html 1.htm
KerryHowery 3y ago
It is my understanding that, because of the durability of the glass in the doors and sunroof, Tesla doors And windows are designed to automatically open when the vehicle becomes submerged. I'm curious as to why this did not happen in this particular situation.

yakshaving_jgt 3y ago

https://archive.is/x0lvr https://archive.is/x0lvr

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

tromp 3y ago

> buying an Italianate mansion downtown and a sprawling ranch just under an hour west. TIL that Italianate means "Italian in character or appearance".

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
INTPenis 3y ago
Sort of like Jordan Schlansky.

bigyikes 3y ago

She put the Tesla in reverse by mistake and backed into a pond.

ghaff 3y ago
The Tesla part seems pretty incidental to this unless their gear controls are unusually confusing and easy to misuse. My Honda controls are not the conventional automatic shift--although Reverse is very clearly differentiated from Drive and it would be hard to press one rather than the other absent just a real mental error.
- gnicholas 3y ago
  I thought the bigger issue was the inability to escape the vehicle once it was underwater. I don’t know the extent to which (1) heavier EVs sink faster than similar-class ICE vehicles, (2) EVs generally are hard to get out of because windows lack manual controls compared to ICE vehicles, or (3) Teslas are particularly lacking in escape mechanisms. Seems like the lesson is to have a window hammer and to break the window before the vehicle fills with water.
  - rkagerer 3y ago
    My dad keeps a hammer in his Tesla to break a window in case he's trapped in without the windows working.
    - sroussey 3y ago
      Will that work in a Cybertruck?
      - rkagerer 3y ago
        Can't promise, but since a steel ball just about broke through I imagine a few determined thwacks with a sledgehammer would do it. https://youtu.be/BqGf8pqCZi0 https://youtu.be/BqGf8pqCZi0
  - dangus 3y ago
    The electronic door poppers should be illegal. They’re so clearly a safety hazard with no cost or function/ease of use upside. Other brands that aren’t Tesla don’t go to such great lengths to hide the emergency releases, too.
  - leohonexus 3y ago
    Model X's laminated glass is near impossible to break underwater according to the article. Instead of a window hammer, in the US you could probably use a handgun to shatter the glass instead. The Cybertruck though uses "bulletproof glass", so you can't even shoot your way to escape - it'll just make a hole to make the car sink faster.
lostlogin 3y ago
The person who wrote the article may have been paid by the word. It would be interesting to read a publication which paid staff to convey the message efficiently.
- Triphibian 3y ago
  It would but the incentives of the Internet (SEO, clickbait, etc.) broke the "inverted pyramid" philosophy in journalism.

nullc 3y ago

How do the shifters work in teslas? A lot of the more recent shifters I've seen in cars just seem very dangerous compared to classic designs-- no feedback, etc. I'm kinda surprised a ranch property wasn't equipt to get a car out of the water or break its windows.

jvanderbot 3y ago
In mine, you press up to shift into reverse, and down to shift into drive, and there are no other options since there's no such thing as "gears" per se. It's super noticeable when you go into reverse, because all screens become backup cameras and the mirrors tilt down so you can see your rear corners. It may play a different ding noise when you shift one vs the other but I can't recall.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- stefan_ 3y ago
  Also, you know, humans are perfectly capable of knowing they are moving backwards. Some sort or sensor fusion SLAM Kalman filter AI in the brain.
cnasc 3y ago
Article says she had a Tesla Model X. Looking online, it appears you shift by either using the touchscreen or some small capacitive buttons that are probably easy to mispress[1]. This is a radical opinion, but that’s the sort of UX malfeasance that should be punished by drawing and quartering even if it doesn’t result in a customer’s death. [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCo3EngU0E https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCo3EngU0E
- ein0p 3y ago
  It's not a "button", it's a slider. It's not easy to "mispress". And I don't think that slider is present on older Model X, so she probably pushed the stalk up to go into reverse. Which IMO is less confusing than most automatic shifter levers, where you have to remember than pulling it _back_ makes the car go forward.

hindsightbias 3y ago

So are the conspiracies that Tesla is a Saneer-Weeksbooth assasination front, China kills their trade partners kids, threat to force Mitch McConnell out, or… I don’t want to delve into 4chan, Hedge fund TX billionaire rantings or Johnson City diner counter theories.

tzs 3y ago
You probably should have mentioned that the article talks a little about the conspiracy theories that have been circulating about this incident, but does not go into much detail about them, and that you are asking for more detail. Most people reading the comments here probably have not read the article, and are going to miss that you are asking for more details rather then pushing conspiracy theories yourself.

dist-epoch 3y ago

> In 2016, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration denied a petition to require carmakers to equip every vehicle with a glass-breaking tool, saying the effectiveness of such a tool isn't known. That's some bizarre logic. Demand that the tool be effective, industry can get together and design a proper tool.

stefan_ 3y ago
I suppose the logic is more that the amount of people able to save themselves, even given the tool, is a rather low number.
gnicholas 3y ago
Having seen more than a few bipping videos, I am inclined to think that there are extremely 'effective' ways to shatter car glass. It's possible this trick doesn't work on laminated glass used in Teslas and other higher-end vehicles, but I've heard of Teslas getting hit — especially the rear corner windows, which give access to the trunk.

mysteria 3y ago

> While making a three-point turn, she had put the car in reverse instead of drive, she said. It is a mistake she had made before with the Tesla gearshift. The car had zipped backward, tipping over an embankment and into a pond. I've shifted to the wrong gear before during parking and so forth, luckily not causing an accident but it caused me to reevaluate my methods. Now after shifting (on an automatic) I let my foot off the brake and let the car creep a little bit before adding throttle if required. If I was in the wrong gear I would step on the brake immediately and the car would only have moved a couple inches. Yes many vehicles have a electronic display on the dash showing the selected gear but an additional confirmation is always the safest. It's like how you shouldn't completely rely on the hot surface light on a stove or the loaded chamber indicator on a handgun. The article also seemed to imply that Chao applied a decent amount of throttle right after shifting gears, causing the car to careen into the pond before she could react. While I can't speak for the exact conditions here but that's not something you should do especially at night with poor visibility.

y-c-o-m-b 3y ago
When I picked up my '23 Model Y, by default it's set not to creep and since it's single-pedal driving, lifting a foot off the brake does nothing. I have my Tesla in "chill mode" though, so I can lightly press the pedal and it'll accelerate very slowly.

jeffbee 3y ago

Suicide by deregulation, essentially.

johnea 3y ago

The primary point of the article seems to be that the WSJ authors were shocked to discover that even rich people can drown if they drive their car into a pond. Maybe if she had put the window down, instead of texting her friends, she would have lived? Reality once again demonstrated it's priority over modern make believe life. It's sad that this person lost their life because of this...

1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago

assets.msn.com faster than wsj.com; for me, yes; ymmv https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-mistake-in-a-tesla-and-a-panicked-final-call-the-death-of-angela-chao/ar-BB1jAkIW https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-mistake-in-a-tesla-and-a... Text-only, no Javascript: tnftp -o'|grep -Eo "\"body\":\".+\"readTimeMin\""' \ https://assets.msn.com/content/view/v2/Detail/en-in/BB1jAkIW \ |(echo "<meta charset=utf-8>";sed 's/\"body\":\"//;s/\\//g; s/\",\"readTimeMin\"//') > 1.htm firefox ./1.htm links -force-html 1.htm

KerryHowery 3y ago

It is my understanding that, because of the durability of the glass in the doors and sunroof, Tesla doors And windows are designed to automatically open when the vehicle becomes submerged. I'm curious as to why this did not happen in this particular situation.