3 ms·

> They're much better at not emitting CO2, for example. They are better, but not necessarily much better. A Toyota Prius Prime can get 39 to 44 miles in electr

> They're much better at not emitting CO2, for example. They are better, but not necessarily much better. A Toyota Prius Prime can get 39 to 44 miles in electric mode [1]. That's good enough for the average person's daily commute or weekend errands, which constitute the vast majority of the miles driven by people. The end result could be a reduction in emissions by 95%. Not 100%, true. But that 100% reduction of an EV is mostly a shifting of emissions to some central power plant, and since electricity is fungible, one can't really say that that particular power plant is solar. In other words, the difference between the overall emissions of an EV vs a good plug-in hybrid (like the Prius Prime) is negligible. [1] https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/features/mpg_other_price/1235/1237/1239 https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/features/mpg_other_price/1...

stavros 3y ago
So we agree that we should switch to 100% EVs and replace all CO2-emitting power plants with renewables, excellent.
- credit_guy 3y ago
  I'm not sure if your reply is snarky or not. I think it is. The Toyota Prius Prime exists today. Switching to renewables is something that is happening today, but we'll be lucky if it will be done in 20 years.
- ProllyInfamous 3y ago
  I would say perhaps 80% EV would "be ideal" for at least another decade [for all those less than 1 mile from home trips everybody is always driving]. But 20% of us would rather not wait around for recharging on our longer roadtrips / commutes, in which case a hybrid drivetrain just makes sense. ---- Related to "snarkiness" : let's agree in no absolutes... nothing is 100%, except death and taxes.
ZeroGravitas 3y ago
If you have a plug available to recharge your commute every day, then you're probably fine with an EV. If you don't then you'd probably prefer an occasional fast charge rather than being limited to slow charging.
zamfi 3y ago
…isn’t that 95% for the Prius also shifting emissions, though? That doesn’t seem like a point in favor of the hybrid. One can’t say that a particular energetic electron was energized by a solar plant, sure. But one can look at new power deployment and see that almost all of it is non-CO2-emitting, a large majority is renewable, and more than half of it is solar. [1] Over the past decade the US has turned over roughly 1-2% of generation capacity annually, and grown by about 1% annually [2]—but those numbers are accelerating: in 2023 we grew about 6%. [1] Totally plausible that we’re at the start of an S-curve here; the grid is certainly not getting dirtier, and with an expected life of > 10 years an EV purchased today will be quite a bit cleaner by EOL based on charging power source alone. [1]: https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/clean-energy/chart-nearly-all-new-us-power-plants-built-in-2024-will-be-clean-energy https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/clean-energy/chart-near... [2]: https://www.publicpower.org/resource/americas-electricity-generating-capacity https://www.publicpower.org/resource/americas-electricity-ge...

stavros 3y ago

So we agree that we should switch to 100% EVs and replace all CO2-emitting power plants with renewables, excellent.

credit_guy 3y ago
I'm not sure if your reply is snarky or not. I think it is. The Toyota Prius Prime exists today. Switching to renewables is something that is happening today, but we'll be lucky if it will be done in 20 years.
ProllyInfamous 3y ago
I would say perhaps 80% EV would "be ideal" for at least another decade [for all those less than 1 mile from home trips everybody is always driving]. But 20% of us would rather not wait around for recharging on our longer roadtrips / commutes, in which case a hybrid drivetrain just makes sense. ---- Related to "snarkiness" : let's agree in no absolutes... nothing is 100%, except death and taxes.

ZeroGravitas 3y ago

If you have a plug available to recharge your commute every day, then you're probably fine with an EV. If you don't then you'd probably prefer an occasional fast charge rather than being limited to slow charging.

zamfi 3y ago

…isn’t that 95% for the Prius also shifting emissions, though? That doesn’t seem like a point in favor of the hybrid. One can’t say that a particular energetic electron was energized by a solar plant, sure. But one can look at new power deployment and see that almost all of it is non-CO2-emitting, a large majority is renewable, and more than half of it is solar. [1] Over the past decade the US has turned over roughly 1-2% of generation capacity annually, and grown by about 1% annually [2]—but those numbers are accelerating: in 2023 we grew about 6%. [1] Totally plausible that we’re at the start of an S-curve here; the grid is certainly not getting dirtier, and with an expected life of > 10 years an EV purchased today will be quite a bit cleaner by EOL based on charging power source alone. [1]: https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/clean-energy/chart-nearly-all-new-us-power-plants-built-in-2024-will-be-clean-energy https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/clean-energy/chart-near... [2]: https://www.publicpower.org/resource/americas-electricity-generating-capacity https://www.publicpower.org/resource/americas-electricity-ge...