5 ms·

This is just so weird to watch. Apple is literally throwing a tantrum on a continent-wide stage. Like, it's one attempt at escalation after another, and they

by ajross 3y ago

This is just so weird to watch. Apple is literally throwing a tantrum on a continent-wide stage. Like, it's one attempt at escalation after another, and they keep losing (either their legal fights, or their nerve) and having to reverse course. Like, there's no strategy at all here? Just keep swinging and hope you land a blow that breaks through the armor? This is how my 15 year old plays VR games.

TillE 3y ago
That's the confusing part. With the DMA policy at least there's a strategy, even if it's a strategy that will ultimately be rejected as non-compliant. Picking these petty fights or whining about getting fined is not helpful, certainly not to Apple and their shareholders. It's hard not to conclude that Apple leadership is making stupid emotional decisions rather than rational ones, which is especially dumb when you're running a trillion dollar company.
- maxwell 3y ago
  Clearly long past time to fire Tim, Phil, and Craig.
- tempodox 3y ago
  My impression is they got used to just bullying everyone into submission by virtue of their market power and they found an opponent where that won't work. Now everyone can see that the emperor has no clothes.
notaustinpowers 3y ago
I don't think there is a strategy, this is all theater so he has some pushback if investors file complaints or lawsuits during the next quarterly results meeting. They can't say that Tim Cook didn't do everything in his power to make them even *more* money. Since, ultimately, his duty as a CEO is to prioritize the financial wealth of shareholders. If he just complied with the EU then he'd be voted out by the board by the end of the week. Is he going overboard? I think so. But I've also never owned a $2T+ company with investors and an entire government breathing down my neck.
- wvenable 3y ago
  > If he just complied with the EU then he'd be voted out by the board by the end of the week. Most companies like Facebook and Microsoft quietly comply with the rules as best they can with as little fanfare as possible. Maybe after paying a fine or two. As far as I know, there hasn't been any oustings because of that.
  - notaustinpowers 3y ago
    Apple hasn't faced a fine yet for this, so there's really no material harm to them for acting like this. And it's great theater for shareholders. I'm sure once we get to the point where the EU is going to begin issuing fines for DMA violations then Apple will change their position. Microsoft was acting like this in the 90s. I think history is just repeating itself with Apple.
    - ajross 3y ago
      > Microsoft was acting like this in the 90s. I think history is just repeating itself with Apple. So... the difference was Microsoft was winning those fights because their enemy was other products in the market. They'd tell Dell not to ship Netscape, and Dell would yank the product. They'd clone java, and websites would code to that to get IE compliance. They'd push ActiveX and bribe web properties to implement it, and they would. This wasn't fair, but it was at least in some sense "competition". (I mean, eventually MS would go on to lose control of all those levers, but over decades of timescale and generally due to market motion.) Apple here is just flailing. It's a regulatory action, not a competitor. There's no feasible path to beating or evading EU law. Surely they know that, right?
      - notaustinpowers 3y ago
        True, trying to reason why Apple is acting like this is just making my head hurt lol
    - JanSt 3y ago
      Breton asked his team to look into the Epic / Apple case with _high priority_ yesterday.
rchaud 3y ago
It works in American courts, where you can file appeal after appeal, during which time you don't have to comply with the court's original verdict.
throwaway118899 3y ago
[flagged]
- idle_zealot 3y ago
  > where they’re the judge, jury, and executioner Yes, typically democratically elected governments include judges, juries, and executioners. They'd be pretty ineffectual otherwise.
  - throwaway118899 3y ago
    [flagged]
corytheboyd 3y ago
Trying again and again until you get what you want seems to be how it works. Seems to be the same for when adversarial change causes enough public backlash. Oh no we were called out for <bad thing>, let’s wait a few months and try again, until it gets through unnoticed enough to show up on the radar.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

by ajross 3y ago

TillE 3y ago

That's the confusing part. With the DMA policy at least there's a strategy, even if it's a strategy that will ultimately be rejected as non-compliant. Picking these petty fights or whining about getting fined is not helpful, certainly not to Apple and their shareholders. It's hard not to conclude that Apple leadership is making stupid emotional decisions rather than rational ones, which is especially dumb when you're running a trillion dollar company.

maxwell 3y ago
Clearly long past time to fire Tim, Phil, and Craig.
tempodox 3y ago
My impression is they got used to just bullying everyone into submission by virtue of their market power and they found an opponent where that won't work. Now everyone can see that the emperor has no clothes.

notaustinpowers 3y ago

I don't think there is a strategy, this is all theater so he has some pushback if investors file complaints or lawsuits during the next quarterly results meeting. They can't say that Tim Cook didn't do everything in his power to make them even *more* money. Since, ultimately, his duty as a CEO is to prioritize the financial wealth of shareholders. If he just complied with the EU then he'd be voted out by the board by the end of the week. Is he going overboard? I think so. But I've also never owned a $2T+ company with investors and an entire government breathing down my neck.

wvenable 3y ago
> If he just complied with the EU then he'd be voted out by the board by the end of the week. Most companies like Facebook and Microsoft quietly comply with the rules as best they can with as little fanfare as possible. Maybe after paying a fine or two. As far as I know, there hasn't been any oustings because of that.
- notaustinpowers 3y ago
  Apple hasn't faced a fine yet for this, so there's really no material harm to them for acting like this. And it's great theater for shareholders. I'm sure once we get to the point where the EU is going to begin issuing fines for DMA violations then Apple will change their position. Microsoft was acting like this in the 90s. I think history is just repeating itself with Apple.
  - ajross 3y ago
    > Microsoft was acting like this in the 90s. I think history is just repeating itself with Apple. So... the difference was Microsoft was winning those fights because their enemy was other products in the market. They'd tell Dell not to ship Netscape, and Dell would yank the product. They'd clone java, and websites would code to that to get IE compliance. They'd push ActiveX and bribe web properties to implement it, and they would. This wasn't fair, but it was at least in some sense "competition". (I mean, eventually MS would go on to lose control of all those levers, but over decades of timescale and generally due to market motion.) Apple here is just flailing. It's a regulatory action, not a competitor. There's no feasible path to beating or evading EU law. Surely they know that, right?
    - notaustinpowers 3y ago
      True, trying to reason why Apple is acting like this is just making my head hurt lol
  - JanSt 3y ago
    Breton asked his team to look into the Epic / Apple case with _high priority_ yesterday.

rchaud 3y ago

It works in American courts, where you can file appeal after appeal, during which time you don't have to comply with the court's original verdict.

throwaway118899 3y ago

[flagged]

idle_zealot 3y ago
> where they’re the judge, jury, and executioner Yes, typically democratically elected governments include judges, juries, and executioners. They'd be pretty ineffectual otherwise.
- throwaway118899 3y ago
  [flagged]

corytheboyd 3y ago

Trying again and again until you get what you want seems to be how it works. Seems to be the same for when adversarial change causes enough public backlash. Oh no we were called out for <bad thing>, let’s wait a few months and try again, until it gets through unnoticed enough to show up on the radar.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]