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But these videos talk constantly. How could watching videos lead to hearing fewer words?

by sp332 3y ago

defrost 3y ago
Talking with adults is highly engaging and interactive for children. The same words and phrases get repeated and iterated over in varying orders and stresses in association with immediate touchable physical objects and executable actions. A week of that would test higher for word|association retention than would a week of watching video with { words, words, words } streaming by non stop. Yes, I do understand that there are videos and shows that are specifically designed to engage and teach young viewers: Playschool, Sesame Street etc .. but these require far more craft than goes into the vast sea of near AI generated pap that streams these days.
sturz 3y ago
They mention that they didn't test for it, but I'd wager that the parents use of devices results in them speaking to the children less.
bdjsiqoocwk 3y ago
Not an expert, but I have the sense that some times toddlers do things just so they can interact with adults. Knowing that I get the sense that they might learn more from an actual person than from a screen everything else being equal.
esarbe 3y ago
If you interact with babies, you'll notice that they are looking at you with an astonished intensity. That's because every neuron in their brain is trying to understand "What is going on!?" Humans are copy-machines. We copy each other. Toddlers and infants especially so. They don't learn by just hearing voices, they need to see how these sounds are made by a real human being with a real voice-box and real lips and real tongue, in which context they are used. Have you ever noticed gesturing while talking to someone on the phone? That's because we constantly try to enrich the words we are making with more context. All that is missing if toddlers are just looking at a screen. It's devastating for learning.
- sp332 3y ago
  Yeah but none of that was measured here. I'm talking about the one thing that was actually in the study.
  - esarbe 3y ago
    Yeah, me too. I would expect that cartoons make up a big part of the screen "diet" of these toddlers and cartoon characters noises are not "words spoken by an adult".
Meninoyo 3y ago
Studies show that toddlers can't learn from video.
- dappermanneke 3y ago
  oh really
  - klyrs 3y ago
    A quick search surfaced this study: https://hechingerreport.org/why-your-toddler-cant-learn-from-a-screen/ https://hechingerreport.org/why-your-toddler-cant-learn-from... GP said studies, plural. I cannot confirm that. But the linked study is consistent with what I observed in my child when he was a toddler.
  - esarbe 3y ago
    Yes, really. There's plenty of studies that show that.
    - dappermanneke 3y ago
      guess toddlers are dumber than babies then https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/dec/01/singing-to-babies-is-vital-to-help-them-understand-language-say-scientists https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/dec/01/singing-to-b...
      - esarbe 3y ago
        The comment you made is obstinate and vapid. It does not refute my point and does not even address it. The article you posted has nothing to do whatsoever with the topic at hand. Neither does it discuss toddlers, nor does it discuss the influence of screen time. If you don't have anything useful to contribute, please be silent. This is not Reddit. Please do your own research next time. > The review indicated that an increase in the amount of screen time and an early age of onset of viewing have negative effects on language development, with older age of onset of viewing showing some benefits. Video characteristics, content and co-viewing also influences language development. This study demonstrates that the negative influences of screen time appear to outweigh the positive influences. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8905397/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8905397/
drewcoo 3y ago
Good point. I wonder if the problem is children's programming.
darkwater 3y ago
They learn to hear (and understand) but they are not exercising speaking back, which is also important. Also, the usual pattern of "parents shoving smartphone into kids eyes to keep them busy" is with very low volume, because parents don't want to hear the frickin' video sounds.
oven9342 3y ago
This dilemma has been named “video deficit”, the reason why children are unable to find the puppet whose location has been shown to them in a video https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/display/document/obo-9780199756841/obo-9780199756841-0187.xml https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/display/document/obo-97...
whywhywhywhy 3y ago
Is all vocabulary equal? After hearing American kids started talking with British mannerisms during the pandemic from watching too much Peppa Pig why would you risk your kid learning English from "Jonny Jonny Yes Papa" or "Finger Family" broken English slop videos

But these videos talk constantly. How could watching videos lead to hearing fewer words?

by sp332 3y ago

But these videos talk constantly. How could watching videos lead to hearing fewer words?

Talking with adults is highly engaging and interactive for children. The same words and phrases get repeated and iterated over in varying orders and stresses in association with immediate touchable physical objects and executable actions. A week of that would test higher for word|association retention than would a week of watching video with { words, words, words } streaming by non stop. Yes, I do understand that there are videos and shows that are specifically designed to engage and teach young viewers: Playschool, Sesame Street etc .. but these require far more craft than goes into the vast sea of near AI generated pap that streams these days.

sturz 3y ago

They mention that they didn't test for it, but I'd wager that the parents use of devices results in them speaking to the children less.

bdjsiqoocwk 3y ago

Not an expert, but I have the sense that some times toddlers do things just so they can interact with adults. Knowing that I get the sense that they might learn more from an actual person than from a screen everything else being equal.

esarbe 3y ago

If you interact with babies, you'll notice that they are looking at you with an astonished intensity. That's because every neuron in their brain is trying to understand "What is going on!?" Humans are copy-machines. We copy each other. Toddlers and infants especially so. They don't learn by just hearing voices, they need to see how these sounds are made by a real human being with a real voice-box and real lips and real tongue, in which context they are used. Have you ever noticed gesturing while talking to someone on the phone? That's because we constantly try to enrich the words we are making with more context. All that is missing if toddlers are just looking at a screen. It's devastating for learning.

sp332 3y ago
Yeah but none of that was measured here. I'm talking about the one thing that was actually in the study.
- esarbe 3y ago
  Yeah, me too. I would expect that cartoons make up a big part of the screen "diet" of these toddlers and cartoon characters noises are not "words spoken by an adult".

Meninoyo 3y ago

Studies show that toddlers can't learn from video.

dappermanneke 3y ago
oh really
- klyrs 3y ago
  A quick search surfaced this study: https://hechingerreport.org/why-your-toddler-cant-learn-from-a-screen/ https://hechingerreport.org/why-your-toddler-cant-learn-from... GP said studies, plural. I cannot confirm that. But the linked study is consistent with what I observed in my child when he was a toddler.
- esarbe 3y ago
  Yes, really. There's plenty of studies that show that.
  - dappermanneke 3y ago
    guess toddlers are dumber than babies then https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/dec/01/singing-to-babies-is-vital-to-help-them-understand-language-say-scientists https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/dec/01/singing-to-b...
    - esarbe 3y ago
      The comment you made is obstinate and vapid. It does not refute my point and does not even address it. The article you posted has nothing to do whatsoever with the topic at hand. Neither does it discuss toddlers, nor does it discuss the influence of screen time. If you don't have anything useful to contribute, please be silent. This is not Reddit. Please do your own research next time. > The review indicated that an increase in the amount of screen time and an early age of onset of viewing have negative effects on language development, with older age of onset of viewing showing some benefits. Video characteristics, content and co-viewing also influences language development. This study demonstrates that the negative influences of screen time appear to outweigh the positive influences. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8905397/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8905397/

drewcoo 3y ago

Good point. I wonder if the problem is children's programming.

darkwater 3y ago

They learn to hear (and understand) but they are not exercising speaking back, which is also important. Also, the usual pattern of "parents shoving smartphone into kids eyes to keep them busy" is with very low volume, because parents don't want to hear the frickin' video sounds.

oven9342 3y ago

This dilemma has been named “video deficit”, the reason why children are unable to find the puppet whose location has been shown to them in a video https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/display/document/obo-9780199756841/obo-9780199756841-0187.xml https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/display/document/obo-97...

whywhywhywhy 3y ago

Is all vocabulary equal? After hearing American kids started talking with British mannerisms during the pandemic from watching too much Peppa Pig why would you risk your kid learning English from "Jonny Jonny Yes Papa" or "Finger Family" broken English slop videos