3 ms·

I've never understood this kind of thing. My immediate impression - as someone with hearing who has never tried one of these vests - is not that deaf people are

I've never understood this kind of thing. My immediate impression - as someone with hearing who has never tried one of these vests - is not that deaf people are being included, but rather they're being given an entirely separate experience. It's almost like if I went to a Taylor Swift concert but brought my headphones and listened to Bon Jovi the whole time. How do you "translate" music into vibrations while preserving the feeling created by the original work? Do these vests actually create a similar experience for deaf people or are they just something novel to occupy themselves with while everyone else is listening to the music? Not trying to be cynical here. I'm genuinely curious if anyone can speak to this from experience.

logiduck 3y ago
> How do you "translate" music into vibrations Is there anything to translate? Music is vibrations to begin with.
- CivBase 3y ago
  Yes but the experience of listening to music is nothing like the experience of someone vibrating your chest. Our brains treat those sensations as very different things.
  - lukaslalinsky 3y ago
    Our brains and other sensory apparatus are extremely adaptable. If one doesn't know anything about the sensation of sound, they can learn to substitute it without it actually being a substitute to them.
schwartzworld 3y ago
> Do these vests actually create a similar experience for deaf people I don't think there's any technology that could make a deaf person feel the difference between major and minor or appreciate counterpoint or whatever, but I don't think that's a standard anybody would expect. Accessibility doesn't mean giving everyone identical experiences because it's impossible. But do you and I even hear the same thing when we listen to the same music? Probably not, or else we'd have the same opinion of it. Creating an experience we all can enjoy is worth it, even if it's never going to be the same. It reminds me of Mr Holland's Opus.
- CivBase 3y ago
  > But do you and I even hear the same thing when we listen to the same music? I say "yes". We can share an experience but come to different conclusions about it. > Creating an experience we all can enjoy is worth it, even if it's never going to be the same. This makes me think of vegan food. I'm not vegan but there are many vegan dishes I thoroughly enjoy. Despite that, I'm consistently disappointed by vegan adaptations of non-vegan dishes. The best vegan dishes IMO are the ones that don't pretend to be something they're not.
  - schwartzworld 3y ago
    How do you know we hear the same thing? We likely don't hear the same frequencies, as these things diminish with age.
hatthew 3y ago
They may not be able to feel the difference between notes, especially in the higher frequencies, but they can still feel the percussion, bass, etc. They can still dance to the same beat as everyone else even if their eyes are closed. They can feel the overall intensity.
keville 3y ago
It's not well-explained in the article but there's a separate artist "playing" the haptic vests via programming, not unlike how a lighting engineer programs the synchronized light shows for a big touring act. Instead of a DMX controller choosing entire scenes that control banks of lights in unison, or narrowing down to individual banks of lights to fine-tune things on the fly with faders, the haptic vests use similar commands and controllers to program different intensities and patterns of vibrations across the sub-regions within the vest. The haptic engineer/artist usually has packs of go-to scenes that work well and provide distinct but complimentary effects from each other scene (just like the lighting engineer), and may have an entire effect chain pre-programmed for a song or mix, or may be choosing and mixing the haptic scenes on-the-fly as they listen to the audio. This NPR article has a better description: https://www.npr.org/2023/07/17/1186173942/vibrating-haptic-suits-give-deaf-people-a-new-way-to-feel-live-music https://www.npr.org/2023/07/17/1186173942/vibrating-haptic-s...

logiduck 3y ago

> How do you "translate" music into vibrations Is there anything to translate? Music is vibrations to begin with.

CivBase 3y ago
Yes but the experience of listening to music is nothing like the experience of someone vibrating your chest. Our brains treat those sensations as very different things.
- lukaslalinsky 3y ago
  Our brains and other sensory apparatus are extremely adaptable. If one doesn't know anything about the sensation of sound, they can learn to substitute it without it actually being a substitute to them.

schwartzworld 3y ago

> Do these vests actually create a similar experience for deaf people I don't think there's any technology that could make a deaf person feel the difference between major and minor or appreciate counterpoint or whatever, but I don't think that's a standard anybody would expect. Accessibility doesn't mean giving everyone identical experiences because it's impossible. But do you and I even hear the same thing when we listen to the same music? Probably not, or else we'd have the same opinion of it. Creating an experience we all can enjoy is worth it, even if it's never going to be the same. It reminds me of Mr Holland's Opus.

CivBase 3y ago
> But do you and I even hear the same thing when we listen to the same music? I say "yes". We can share an experience but come to different conclusions about it. > Creating an experience we all can enjoy is worth it, even if it's never going to be the same. This makes me think of vegan food. I'm not vegan but there are many vegan dishes I thoroughly enjoy. Despite that, I'm consistently disappointed by vegan adaptations of non-vegan dishes. The best vegan dishes IMO are the ones that don't pretend to be something they're not.
- schwartzworld 3y ago
  How do you know we hear the same thing? We likely don't hear the same frequencies, as these things diminish with age.

hatthew 3y ago

They may not be able to feel the difference between notes, especially in the higher frequencies, but they can still feel the percussion, bass, etc. They can still dance to the same beat as everyone else even if their eyes are closed. They can feel the overall intensity.

keville 3y ago

It's not well-explained in the article but there's a separate artist "playing" the haptic vests via programming, not unlike how a lighting engineer programs the synchronized light shows for a big touring act. Instead of a DMX controller choosing entire scenes that control banks of lights in unison, or narrowing down to individual banks of lights to fine-tune things on the fly with faders, the haptic vests use similar commands and controllers to program different intensities and patterns of vibrations across the sub-regions within the vest. The haptic engineer/artist usually has packs of go-to scenes that work well and provide distinct but complimentary effects from each other scene (just like the lighting engineer), and may have an entire effect chain pre-programmed for a song or mix, or may be choosing and mixing the haptic scenes on-the-fly as they listen to the audio. This NPR article has a better description: https://www.npr.org/2023/07/17/1186173942/vibrating-haptic-suits-give-deaf-people-a-new-way-to-feel-live-music https://www.npr.org/2023/07/17/1186173942/vibrating-haptic-s...